• http://pulse.yahoo.com/_LL4QDJLVFDT2RDIZYBALSE75JE angel29

    I understand why he got mad but tact is a requirement amongst people his stature.  One cannot just curse, and less so generalize an entire race for the action of a few.  He may not be a racist but he also did not act accordingly.  He knew that he was also wrong in his response and no matter how degrading the cause was, he should have been the bigger man.  No one was throwing tomatoes or eggs at him.  People did not say let’s go and boycott him.  There was a party and people were having fun. Were the crowd rude?  Yes.  It may be at his performance’s expense but he was not the first artist to ever be humiliated on stage.  There have been worse cases.  Black ocean anyone? The humiliation was something he should have taken like a man and an artist. That was what his apology was for.  I’m glad he apologized and explained his side.

    • http://twitter.com/rentrule12 ana

       I fully agree I am glad he apologize

    • GaCaRa

      Did you just compare jealous fangirls to the institutionalized discrimination of minorities by societies?

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_LL4QDJLVFDT2RDIZYBALSE75JE angel29

        I raised another form of insult only as an example of what artists go through or may on stage when they perform live. 

        • peachstem

          “No one was throwing tomatoes or eggs at him. People did not say let’s go and boycott him. There was a party and people were having fun. Were the crowd rude? Yes. It may be at his performance’s expense but he was not the first artist to ever be humiliated on stage.”

          Can you explain to me how racist remarks equate with people “having fun” at a party? How should rudeness – especially to this extent – be excused in any situation, especially just because some oppas or unnies suffered before him?

          “There have been worse cases. Black ocean anyone?

          It’s almost funny how you think black ocean is a “worse” case.

          “The humiliation was something he should have taken like a man and an artist.”

          If you’re saying he should have taken it like he deserved those comments, or instead smile prettily like those doll-faced idols in Korea who have to kiss the ass of their fans no matter what, I strongly disagree with you. I do think there are better ways to handle this situation, but saying he should just shut up and take it again and again and again is a ridiculous idea.

    • Doge Wallace

      Yeah, so if Dave Chappelle goes up on stage doing his comedy, and people heckle him to do the black pixie sketch, how should he respond? It’s not about humiliation, it’s complete degradation, which is different. I don’t know how you take degradation “like a man”.

  • Hur5678

    Don’t be ridiculous. If racism is prejudice + power, then if a man in a male-dominated society has prejudice towards women, he is racist towards women? How does that definition make sense at all?

    • https://twitter.com/#!/LimaCake LimaCake

      Uh, no. That would be sexist, bro. Which is the same concept.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Nate-Broadus/100003245734823 Nate Broadus

    I’m glad he clarified his position. Reverse racism is still racism, so I’m glad he acknowledged that the actions of a few idiots does not represent all people with white skin. Thankfully, there are sensible people in all races (they just get drowned out by the morons too easily).

    I cannot come out and say that his comments were appropriate, anymore than I could say the same about Michael Richards or any other entertainer who has lapsed into racist speech in the heat of the moment. I can say, in the context of this performance, I can understand WHY he felt the need to speak out so loudly, though.

    It is one thing to be heckled at a comedy show, and quite another to have your entire performance disregarded in favor of some gimmicky dance that some people foolishly equate to an Asian dance. Especially if the artist in question is known for tackling complex emotional, social and societal issues in his/her music. Tiger JK has a tendency to go a little deeper than hollow bling raps in his work. 8:45 Heaven is still one of the more emotional songs I’ve heard from a hip hop artist. There isn’t anything thuggish about it — just a song documenting the pain and sorrow of someone who just lost an important person (made even worse by the fact that they were unable to say their goodbyes beforehand). So to have your audience clamor loudly for you to stop speaking on your message, to just do “your Asian dance,” would be infuriating. That is no different than saying to a woman speaking at a podium, “Tits or gtfo!”, disregarding anything of value she might have to say in favor of misogyny, or assuming all Latino people eat nothing but tacos or burritos or any of the other completely asinine assumptions more racially insensitive douchebags are prone to make.

    Sadly, this is just one of the negative byproducts of Psy’s crossover success — and it is not anything he could have avoided. Psy didn’t do Gangnam Style to make it easier for dipshits to pigeonhole Asian artists in an image of parody, he was just being himself. Humor always runs through his music and image. Unfortunately, when your work is thrown to the pop culture masses, you lose a great deal of control as far as which direction your work is going to shift. If narrow-minded people want to assume your lark is somehow indicative of how an entire race dances, it will go that way even if more rational people shout that it is not true. That is the ugly side of these large scale pop culture phenomenons. 

    The racial tint to all of this is there through no fault of Psy, Tiger JK, or anyone else — pop culture is the only thing that can be blamed. I rarely find that a situation can be blamed on one side or the other. More often than not, both sides are wrong in some way. Few arguments or disagreements get there through the fault of one entity. But in this case, it is entirely on the shoulders of pop culture — or more specifically, dumbass people within pop culture’s audience that speak without thinking clearly (some probably realize later how dickish they sounded), or who just simply don’t care (let’s not pretend there aren’t real, true, absolute racist dickheads out there).

    The WAY Tiger JK responded was wrong. I am glad he came out and apologized for it. Outright racism should not be an excuse for outright racism — especially when not everyone with white skin at the performance were standing with the guilty. WHAT he said, however, is justified. 

    Asians (as a race) are not clowns that do a funny dance on cue. A lot of Asian artists take their artistry seriously, so why on earth would you assume they would be cool with dropping the message for some party dance? This applies even to non-Asian artists. 

    Would you ask Maynard James Keenan to do the Macarena in the middle of Lateralus? I would go off on somebody in the crowd if they did something that stupid. It’s a song about thinking laterally, not limiting yourself to existence, to reality, to expand your whole sense of being, to grasp the concept of being deific while still remaining human. 

    “Stop singing and do the Macarena!”

    Yeah, I can see why Tiger JK exploded the way he did.

    • GaCaRa

      There is no such thing as reverse racism

      • straighttohelvetica

        Biggest like ever. If “reverse racism” were a thing, people would be vilifying and criticizing the actions of the white boys who started this mess instead of Tiger JK’s response.

        • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

           Oh but they would have done if he had not been such an idiot :-)

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Nate-Broadus/100003245734823 Nate Broadus

            Precisely.

            That is part of the point — if JK had handled it better, less explosively, K-rap and K-pop fans across many media platforms would be crucifying those people for their ignorance. We can pretend that wouldn’t be 100% true, but we’ve already seen how K-entertainment fans respond to even more trivial things (Do you think Snoop has forgotten?).

          • straighttohelvetica

            I’m sure Tiger JK deals with a lot of instances of racism “less explosively,” which is what lead to this. You can only handle so much crap before you blow up.

          • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

            Remember, he is has set himself as an example and a posterboy for never doing that? So when he does that, it is not illogical that people call him out on that. You know, not just white people. People. Ah and also, he apologised, so you know, move on, too.

          • straighttohelvetica

            And again, sometimes it gets too much and you snap and go off. I know; I’ve done it. I just don’t think any of us who don’t find ourselves in that same situation can sit here and say “well, he should have worded it like this” or “he should have been calmer” etc.

          • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

             I think you should stop identifying. Tiger JK and you are not the same, mostly because of his commitment to not being racist and to fight it. Publicly. Unless you are a public person I don’t think this plays out the same.You don’t wear fur if you have sworn against it. And if you do, people are going to say stuff. Secondly , what is the point of some people being shocked by this article ? It’s that Tiger JK apologised because he exploded. Fair enough. Apparently the author thinks he should not have. And I think it’s only fair that he did. Unless you want to have a heartwarming and wonderfully divisive and race-ridden conversation, you are more careful with your words.

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Nate-Broadus/100003245734823 Nate Broadus

            It doesn’t make it anything other than wrong.

            Besides, assuming this incident was the straw that broke the camel’s back is just supposition. It adds nothing, except to give JK an excuse for acting in this manner — which isn’t needed, because his action, not the man, is the issue here. It doesn’t matter at all WHY he did it. He did it; it was wrong; it is as simple as that. This is not about demonizing Tiger JK, and all about explaining why his reaction was the wrong way to react, no matter the excuse.

          • straighttohelvetica

            I didn’t assume; he said it in the tweet: 

            “then it triggered something really dark in me.” 

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Nate-Broadus/100003245734823 Nate Broadus

            Then I was wrong, this apparently was the straw that broke this particular camel’s back.

            That still doesn’t make what he did correct, justifiable, or excusable.

            I shouldn’t repeat myself, though. I responded again in another post. Read it if you want to know my perspective, dismiss it if you do not.

          • New York City

            I agree, when it comes to being made fun of WHILE your on stage, all your heart comes out first before your head. I feel him, I really do, anyone would have done the same thing, whether he was black, white, yellow, blue, pink, whatever. I would have said worse things lol, but I never regret. First reactions are correct in my eyes cause it comes straight from the heart. All musicians are connected deeply emotionally with their music. Tiger JK is one of them. PSY isn’t connected deeply in his music, he is purely and entertainer, Tiger JK is a voice.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            Okay if you think Tiger JK is wrong that is fine, but completely ignoring what the white people in audience did because Tiger JK loss his cool is a way of dismissing a real problem at hand. It’s kinda derailing to the situation. 

          • http://www.facebook.com/people/Nate-Broadus/100003245734823 Nate Broadus

            That is exactly why he needed to apologize. Because of the rant, all anyone could focus on was Tiger JK — had he not lost it, we would be discussing the hecklers and the nature of stereotypes. 

            Now that he has apologized for his actions (not his words — they were right on), hopefully, people can move onto the issue of the hecklers.

          • Guest

             Would have loved an article on that, actually, hopefully a counterpoint is going to come.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Nate-Broadus/100003245734823 Nate Broadus

        Response incoming.

        Cliff notes: There very much is reverse racism — but it is far too complex to map out in a few terse sentences. 

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Nate-Broadus/100003245734823 Nate Broadus

      Alright, first off, I suppose I’ll start by pointing out the one part of the article above with which I vehemently disagree:

      “Tiger JK was also not being racist by cursing out “white folk.” Reverse racism does not exist. The definition of racism is prejudice plus power. If you do not have the power — granted to you systematically through various institutions normalized by your society — to purposefully oppress another race, you cannot be racist. You can be prejudiced and you can be discriminatory, but you cannot be racist*.”

      I disagree with this point of view, Amy — mostly because it involves skewing the definition of a word in a few different directions (in this case, “racism”). People, on all different topics, have done this for so long it is nauseating (not you, just slanting definitions). It reminds me of atheists and Christians constantly going at it, supported by their own interpretation of scripture and science. When you shift the definition of a word, or a saying, it can go in many different directions. For instance, “power” — to me, that does not mean simply “institutional” power as you defined it in the article. 

      Did you know Martin Luther King Jr had the power to destroy city blocks? He did. Ask any of the hundreds of people outside King’s home the night it was firebombed, all of whom were brandishing knives and guns, ready to go out and tear Atlanta a new one. Dr. King’s wife and infant child could have been in that blast (thankfully, they were not). He had every right to be incomprehensibly rage driven. Instead, he said, verbatim:

      ‘Don’t get panicky. Don’t do anything panicky. Don’t get your weapons. If you have weapons, take them home. He who lives by the sword will perish by the sword. Remember that is what Jesus said. We are not advocating violence. We want to love our enemies. I want you to love our enemies. Be good to them. This is what we must live by. We must meet hate with love.’”

      Does JK wield the power to send a city up in flames? Lol, not even close. However, he does have the power to shift opinion. Let’s just look at ourselves for a moment; how many of us already had some idea of how we were going to react simply by reading “Tiger JK” and “racist” in the same title? Be honest. I know I already had my mind working a little, though I hadn’t settled on a concrete opinion.

      Reverse racism, reactionary racism, incited racism — it doesn’t matter how you skew the term, it all boils down to the ugly act of subsuming large groups of people into one categorically flawed group. That was Tiger JK’s mistake, and as an intelligent, honorable man, he realized this and apologized for his actions. 

      His words were spot on. The way those hecklers acted was the true crime, even if it was done without malice. But a man is responsible for how he acts, and with not only the eyes of his fans, but also the eyes of his family on him, a man has to be aware of when he makes a mistake (and all men DO make mistakes) and then swallow his pride and apologize if his actions — not the man, himself, his actions — were in the wrong. In that way, JK acted like a man and admitted that he SHOULD have handled it better. 

      So yes, in my opinion, he NEEDED to apologize. As a man who has people that look up to him, who are influenced by his mannerisms and choices — even if not by choice, it’s just a side effect of fame — he needed to show people how to accept responsibility for his part in this and then assert that while his ACTIONS were certainly in the wrong, the content of his words were very accurate.

      Whether you want to call what he did reverse racism or any other myriad of terms, it all eventually just means he fanned the flames. Fighting fire with fire only achieves short term goals. For any real change to happen, you can’t meet hate with hate, as Dr. King said so eloquently.

      JK’s words will be much more powerful coming from a composed, knowledgeable man, not screamed in the heat of the moment with abandon; with this apology, he has now placed himself in a position to highlight this sad state of affairs with a fresh perspective, if he so chooses.

      • http://evacuatewithstyle.org/blog Amy

        I see your point but I very, very much do not agree that Martin Luther King being able to incite a group of people to destroy city blocks is in any way the same as racism so institutionalized, so naturalized, so engrained into the national psyche that it denies rights, denies housing, denies medical services to a group of people based on their race. Until whites can — AS A GROUP — be systematically be denied those things because of the color of their skin, I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree about reverse racism.

        • http://www.facebook.com/people/Nate-Broadus/100003245734823 Nate Broadus

          Fair enough. We don’t have to agree on any of this. We just see things from different points of view.

          The point of the MLK reference, though, was meant more to illustrate precisely why I felt JK needed to apologize, not so much the nature of racism and the existence of reverse racism. How people perceive you is something that cannot be changed, but how you react is entirely on your own shoulders (unless you are incapable of thinking for yourself, which I think we both can agree JK doesn’t fit that bill). Ranting at the hecklers solved nothing, except to fan the flames of yet another racially-themed discussion (and not the good kind; the kind where two people on different sides of the racial divide attempt to come to some resolution). 

          Although I also made it to illustrate how even the definition of racism made in the article (prejudice + power) is far too easily slanted. If you are talking about racism being defined by “institutional” power, then you are absolutely correct that reverse racism (against WHITE people — more on this later) does not exist by that definition; I am just of the opinion, based on what I have personally witnessed, that people in a position of “cultural” power (leaders like MLK and pop culture icons like Tiger JK who have the ears of a certain segment of people) do have a potent degree of control when it comes to shifting opinion — which can be a dangerous thing these days. 

          In this day and age, shifting opinion is not something to take lightly. Never in the history of man has information been shared so freely, absorbed so cavalierly and enforced so brutally on a global scale as happens right now. Because of this, I do believe that reverse racism exists — because racist ideology can still influence people to do some radical things. 

          I should also point out, racism doesn’t stop being racism just because it happens to white people. I am not even white, but I feel that is a very unfair position to take.

        • http://twitter.com/sisiberlyn Sierra Bell

          I’m sorry, but my understanding of racism doesn’t just include the things you mentioned, it also includes flat out being hateful to people based on the color of their skin. I have heard people say that “white people have ugly, doglike hair” or “she has a nice body for a white girl” and I have had it said to my FACE that “it’s ok, you’re a white girl so you’re not expected to have a nice figure.” Granted, these are all superficial things, but they were all hurtful to me because, like skin color, they are things I can’t help. Jesus made me this way, and if anyone has a problem with that, that’s their problem and not mine, but that doesn’t change the fact that it is hurtful and alienating, just like any other kind of racism (although I have to say I hate the term “reverse racism” because racism is racism regardless of the victim).

      • regina_filange

        word on the semantics of it all. racism is racism, as generally prescribed by most to describe actions or comments against somebody because of/ while inciting race. And even if he wasn’t racist by definition, he damn well did something wrong, and it involved race relations, and his apology was necessary. I would have so little respect from him otherwise.

        also. do you blog? i don’t wanna have to wait for an article to know about your perspective in the comments. i will be your following. just do it.

        • http://www.facebook.com/people/Nate-Broadus/100003245734823 Nate Broadus

          Wish I had the time. Real life doesn’t slow down enough for me to maintain a consistent blog at a pace that I would find acceptable. It is also why I didn’t respond to that call for new writers at SB (that and my articles on the K-industry would likely be too subversive, too often).

    • http://twitter.com/MusicTeaorg MusicTea.org

      “It is one thing to be heckled at a comedy show, and quite another to have your entire performance disregarded in favor of some gimmicky dance that some people foolishly equate to an Asian dance.”
      THIS. End of story.

      You made a lot of good points. “That is no different than saying to a woman speaking at a podium, “Tits or gtfo!”, disregarding anything of value she might have to say in favor of misogyny”, since I’m female, was especially painful. In the end, the real issue is racial stereotyping instead of seeing a person as an individual, with their own unique personality. If I were Tiger JK I would have gotten pretty angry too.

    • http://www.facebook.com/victoria.tee3 Victoria Tee

      Did you not read the article? There is no such thing as reverse racism. As the author wrote racism = racial prejudice plus power. White people are in the position of power to deny people of colour access to jobs, education, legal representation etc based on their race. My mum did not get a job back in the 70s because she was black. The white employer  already had one black machinist so didn’t want to hire any more. 
       Racism is not people not liking you because of your race/colour. Racism is not an equal opportunities employer.  It’s only those with the power that can deny you access and opportunities simply because you are not white. It was white people that made laws ie Apartheid and Jim Crow where black people had to defer to whites, where black people had to give up their seats to white etc. Yes  people of colour can be prejudice against whites and other people of colour but we can never be racist. 

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Nate-Broadus/100003245734823 Nate Broadus

        I clarified in a later comment my definition of reverse racism and discrimination. Responsive racism might be more appropriate for how I responded and the comments I made. 

        Either way, the important point is not the term, it’s the existence of any form of discrimination in the first place and whether it is acceptable in any form (either reactionary or otherwise); It is not. 

        So call it discrimination, prejudice, reverse racism, upside down racism, sideways racism, inside out racism — at the end of the day, it’s still marginalizing the value of a person down to a pigment of skin. It’s still not right, and Tiger JK very much needed to (and thankfully did) apologize for his part in this situation. It doesn’t matter if people of color can never be racist — we can still be narrow-minded, hypocritical, discriminating bigots. 

        Does that really make it any better? Bigot, racist — they’re all ugly as fuck.

  • hapacalgirl

    Whether you believe it was racism or not , it was wrong for him to go on a tirade in the middle of the performance and it was wrong of him to generalize an entire race based on the actions of a few and for those reasons I am glad he was mature enough to apologize. Hollywood doesn’t represent everyone and not everyone in the United States is white. Generalizing any race is wrong, just like not every korean is psy or Kim Jeong, not every white person is like those hecklers at the concert. You can not criticize the prejudice of the asian community (which is perpetrated by african americans, mexicans , and other cultures, not just white people) and then go and support the prejudice of white people, thats the definition of being a hypocrite.

    • igbygrl

      May I ask you would you react differently if you we’re in Tiger JK’s situation? For a long time he had to battle the sole controversy of siring a half child…I think going through such a controversial and rough situation can make anyone become a loose cannon, especially when they have to deal with the sole fact of his personal, married life being criticized in the spotlight.

      • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

         which is why he should know better than treating people exactly the way he’s been treated ?

        • igbygrl

          Well I highly doubt anyone would be able to act and respond to such onslaught of racial slurs on stage with a rational mind and respectful approach. He was on stage and the hecklers were his audience. That’s a pretty scary and tight spot to be in if you ask me. Like the saying goes Judge not lest he be judged and let him who is without sin cast the first stone. Being a celebrity is a pretty scary job. The perks are great but the media and the public scrutiny is even greater.

          • Claire

             I agree on that. then again. I also want to suggest that there are other ways to explode than on Twitter in front of everyone when you are a public person. He lost it, went too far, apologised, By the way it was great apology. So why saying he should not have ? The highly confusing thing with this article is that it connects the author’s view or racism with the idea of not saying sorry. I guess you can see why this has a whole lot of people very perplex. I have quite simple ideas on life : if you insult someone and especially if you go overboard and say things that are unfair, you say sorry. That’s a decent thing to do. I think this would also have been a great opportunity to seize to say that white people are a more complex reality than stupid people in an audience. You know, some like Kpop, and they are here to discuss it, and they are honestly dumbfounded, because chances are great they have nothing in common with people in the Creator’s project’s audience. I guess you can also understand the hurt. Also would have been a great opportunity for people to understand that there is no such thing as “White people” group attitude outside of the States, if it is even relevant in the States. I am personally French, European and Caucasian. And I feel like someone is using the colour of my skin to say things that I am not, and this would be ironically the first time I react as “a white person”. I can see where the author is coming from, but as I said many times, articles like that are dangerous. So yeah, peace out. 

          • igbygrl

            Yeah I don’t fully agree with the article either. I think what most posters who are getting upset about Tiger JK’s comment are missing the point that his crude remarks on the heckler’s stems from his own frustrations with his personal demons. He seems like a doting father who wants to protect his wife and child from public scrutiny and such ignorance. but since his job entails to be in the public eye he will feel such prejudice and discrimination 3 times fold. Even though his comment was really unnecessary, at least his apology explained and gives some closure as to why he reacted the way he did on that stage. For that I think some people should just leave it that and not get so upset over something this guy needs to deal on his own.

      • hapacalgirl

        I am actually a half child myself and I would like to believe I would of acted differently since I typically keep my emotions to myself in professional situations. But I am not him and I wasn’t in this situation but like other commentators have mentioned, as an artist, although those concert goers were unbelievably rude, he should of been professional and act accordingly and not lose his temper and apparently he sees that which is why he apologized.

  • http://twitter.com/nadga13 Gil

    Racism is prejudice against skin plus power. What Tiger JK did was not racism. He had every right to address the hecklers, could he have done it in a different way? In my opinion yes, however that’s not what happened and he apologized. What we should not be looking at in this situation is saying that this is racism, Tiger JK as an Asian does not hold power over White people because the latter inherently holds the power in the system, they have support because of the majority and power the race holds. That is not to say white people can’t be discriminated against, they most definitely can but discrimination =/= racism. Though his generalization of white people may not exactly have been kosher, it is not an unsurprising reaction. After years of   being victims of racism you get tired and will lash out. Believe me I have gone on tirades when some ignorant ass hat calls me a “dot head” or “sand ni**er” it’s a defense mechanism almost. While we can criticize his actions we shouldn’t call it racism. 

    • http://twitter.com/logton11 Jasmin Davis

      Discrimination: 1. treatment or consideration of, or making a distinction in favor of or against, a person or thing based on the group,class, or category to which that person or thing belongs rather than on individual merit

      Racism:
      1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human   races  determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one’s own race is superior and has the right to rule others, 2.a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; **discrimination**.

      So racism= discrimination.

      It is racism to generalize an entire race of people, especially from the actions of a few. He had no reason to bring up race, he couldn’t have determined the races of the hecklers just from face value. Even after years of racism, it doesn’t give a person to be racist in retaliation. Racism is wrong, no matter who’s the victim or the bully; it is the stereotyping of races not entirely skin color, and doesn’t necessarily include power. He was racist for discriminating against white people(which in itself is called racism) from the actions of a few hecklers in a crowd. 

      Their race has nothing to do with their ignorance. I will criticize his actions and I will call it what it is: racism.

      Credit: http://dictionary.reference.com

      • straighttohelvetica

        It’s prejudiced to generalize an entire race of people from the actions of a few. Racism is systematic and involves power and privilege of populations within society as a whole.

        • http://twitter.com/logton11 Jasmin Davis

          Didn’t this occur in Korea where Koreans are the majority and whites are the minorities in society? By that logic, Tiger JK was racist for bringing up white people in conservative country with a society of it’s own, where the majority and one’s in power are Korean, outside of the US or other ‘white dominated’ places.

      • LuxeLife

        racism has never and will never be completely synonymous with discrimination.

        do they go together? yes.

  • k_db

    To be honest, Tiger always came off as a douchebag to me.  

  • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

    “tacltless” = wow.

    I practically disagree with everything written on this article. Every argument could be turned around, since Asian people  also have a racist perception of white and black people based on prejudice. And every group toward every group on this planet. And its absolutely his fault for pulling the racial trigger, not once, but FLOODING his Twitter account with it. Real nice. He was dead wrong for racialising the issue, calling white people out, as we (since I am French and Caucasian) are indeed a whole group. Not even American, Europeans or Oceanians or whatever. First, when you say something along those lines of “f*** {insert colour} people”, you are being racist. There is no way around it, sorry. You could justify at length that it was in retaliation for something unfair or humiliating, but it fits the definition of racism perfectly.The guys presents itself like the bigger person, and he does exactly the same as those idiots did that night.
     
    Second, coming from someone who when out of his way to speak out against perception based on race, colour, it is an incredible let down. He has a front row seat to know that indeed not all white people are “white people” and that when you start mentioning skin colour to refer to someone you are on a slippery slope. It is unforgivable unless the guys does some serious thinking on how he sees the world, people and races in it.

    By the way, speaking about Psy : guy is working through prejudices quitely everyday at the minute. He kindly asked when he came on Ellen if he could not just dance but also introduce himself and his country. He is a beast on stage, and that alone is living proof that there is more to Asian entertainement then people thought. I don’t know of any racist rant that changed people’s attitudes, unless you call a fight in the bar between drunken people a change of attitude, but when it comes to being an entertainer who brings people together then that’s more like it. I don’t know of a perfect world or attitudes being changed overnight, but I am sure hating on someone is never going to raise one’s case.

    Oh and also, the classic claim against Chelsea Lately, this is so typical. For one, she invited him and mentioned him in another show with her team doing the choreo which means she likes him, because you may not like her but she says it like it is. You may not like that she is cynical and voices her thoughts with no filter but thats also what makes her brave and refreshing, and probably more tolerant and open minded than a lot of politically correct fools out there. The segment with Psy was hilarious. His unfazed expression the whole time is really funny and when she says “that’s an Asian I could date”, I can tell she is practically laughing in advance of the crap she is going to get -again. So that’s rich that you are using that kind of argument, calling her a racist to defend someone who did well worse. Maybe Tiger JK is not on the good side of things, but in no way does that excuse him.

    • GaCaRa

      Going by the definition that racism = prejudice + power, then yes racism does exist in other countries where one racial group hold the most power, including Korea, with its attitudes towered forign workers and biracial Koreans. But here’s the thing: a Korean would not be able to transfer their institutionalized superiority to a “White” country liketheUS, but a white person van transfer their own instilled sense of superiority to Korea, and feel as though they have every right to stop a performer from displaying their own creations because they’re not interested. THAT is white privilege: white people have a much larger domain of power than any other racial group, and that power fosters a sense of entitlement which leads to situations likethis heckling.

      • Bhongo

        THIS

      • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

        Now that’s a very subjective definition of racism which surprisingly well fits as an excuse for Tiger JK. It is fascinating how people will go at great lengths to try and understand, even worse justify this rant. It was not just one tweet, it was an ongoing heinous flood where he could instead have been a class act and raise awareness. And believe me, I would have been the first in line to applaud.
        It is exceptionally surprising that you will put so much effort in justifying that since the guys has a/ apologised (and rightly so) , b/ he presents himself as an advocate against racism. Does anti racism not apply to white people as a group ? (since apparently white people are that) ? If you’re going to be the voice of wisdom and you act like the worst of douches, sorry but I am not going to go all power/race/cultural theories to defend you and your image.

      • RC_RC

        You don’t have to go by that definition. It is your choice to define racism like that. 

    • http://twitter.com/RoknRollPumpkin E-Bone

      It’s funny. “Political Correctness” seems to take on this weird negative connotation when people saying racist things get called out on their bullsh*t. Although in my day, we called it “not being racist”. Didn’t seem to sting as much then.

      And if the “classic claim” against Chelsea Lately is the claim that she routinely says racist things, it’s because she does (noting your use of “classic” implies it’s been said more than once). Anyone who’s seen her show knows she LOVES clowning on Asians. The fact that she had Psy on her show doesn’t negate that one iota.

      • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

        Oh please, she is horrible with everyone. Blacks, Whites Asians, you name it. The worse she’s been is not even remotely with Asian people – see the incident with Serbia-. Although I don’t condone what she says, one very important thing about her is that she makes fun about herself more than anything else in the world. That will explain the character more than loads of speculations, as well as her actions in life, in terms of dating, her working mates and everything really. She is a mirror through which everyone can see their own prejudices, starting with her own persona and her own origins.

        Political correctness in that context is not about not being racist, it is just about not caring and at all about who you are dealing with and just go with the flow. And in the end treating Psy  like a human prop exactly the same way, because he is in fashion, but who really cares what’s in his mind ? Ellen when she says it “yeah we love you” when he attempts at speaking? I don’t see that’s better, just hypocritical.
        So I don’t see how it is a better attitude. It just neutrally continues prejudices.

        • http://twitter.com/RoknRollPumpkin E-Bone

          Sorry, but the “everyone is a bit racist” argument won’t fly here, either. As a matter of fact, Handler is one of the many US public figures who is guilty of routinely making derogatory statements about PoC and passing it off as “comedy”. I don’t actually believe she is racist, but a lot of the things she says are absolutely problematic.

          Also, I’m afraid I didn’t understand your second paragraph because I thought you were using political correctness (as I had interpreted from your original comment) as a way to say it’s better to say what you’re thinking outright than try to sugar coat it. And, to be fair, I agree. I’d much rather have someone straight up tell me they hate me as opposed to “I’m not racist, buuuuut…. (insert racist comment).” At least then I’d know exactly where they stood. 

          • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

             The things she says are problematic because society is problematic. And complex. The thing with insults is that they are simple. And easily dismissed.

          • http://twitter.com/RoknRollPumpkin E-Bone

            No, the things she says are problematic are problematic because they are racist. She’s not providing critique on or lampooning stereotypes, she’s perpetuating them.

          • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

             I completely disagree on that. She gives people a mirror where they look at themselves, and she does that by calling herself an idiot first. That is the mark of being a comic. When she says “that’s and Asian I could date”, I was watching with my friends, and it actually got them thinking a lot on that. She is not perpetuating, she is thought provoking. How many people identifying with racism do watch Chelsea? She is liberal and trashy.

            It might not be your style, but she is a useful character to me. Dont call out on the symptom, call it out on society.

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/YDPIHIGHY6Y6FF6T3PBFZMDFBQ huaxin

      I closed this page but had to come back just because I couldn’t get this phrase out of my mind.

      “Every argument could be turned around, since Asian people  also have a
      racist perception of white and black people based on prejudice. And
      every group toward every group on this planet”.

      Just to get this out of the way: no one is saying that he was right to have generalized and cussed out all white people the way he did.

      But that statement – that “every argument could be turned around” and “every group” on this planet has a “racist perception of white and black people based on prejudice” towards “every group on this planet” – I’m sorry, I just entirely disagree with this.

      Everybody has their stereotypes, that’s true. Everybody is perhaps discriminatory towards everyone else to some extent. I’m willing to agree with that.

      But racism is an entrenched system that affects people in so many parts of their life. The guy over the counter speaking more slowly to you because he thinks you’re Asian and you can’t understand English. The guy you know of who gets heckled by his white girlfriend’s family because he’s a person of colour. The shop keeper who doesn’t like Spanish music in his shop just because. The job you get passed over for just because of your surname.

      Look, I’m not saying that prejudice doesn’t exist, but I just want people to see that racism is entirely on another level from prejudice. And that’s what some of us in this thread are talking about. Institutionalized racism. Not simply something dumb someone says one day. More like something dumb so many people are saying so loudly you can’t clap your hands over your ears to block it out even if you want to.

      I can see why you’re saying the things you’re saying about Tiger JK being rude in his turn. I entirely agree I can see why you’re offended by what he said.

      But I just want to say not to – dilute? for the lack of a better word – the reason behind him blowing up. He was wrong to have blown up but the people who were racist towards him and the system that encourages this racism and far more deserving of criticism.

      • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

         Well I would have agreed entirely on what you said and to be honest I think we are not really far off in opinion. But I think everyone is basically endorsing whatever definition of racism that it convenient to make their point. Mine is pretty simple : it is NEVER ok under any circumstances to insult a group based on the colour of their skin. Even white people. You are like a lot of people here – and believe me I understand- adding the power and oppression factor, the racism that is being perpetuated through social structures.

        Racism does not need power to be racism. White people – I am Caucasian to make it clear- have every right to be hurt, especially since apparently we are single out as a group now, marked with the stamp of ignorance and bigotry, reduced to the actions of a single group of drunkards at a party. It is racist. based on race, not complicated. It is easy to say that being in the position of power there should be no offence taken. Should be people not feel hurt about it because they still have to pay the bill as a fantasised group for what, colonisation, segregation, social prejudices ? Does Tiger JK get a pass for his comments on that because of this ? Hell no, because he is really not helping his case. What the hell with “white people” ? Then again, for someone who is supposed to have thought about it, this is even more worrying.  Talk about entrenched racism. It was a cascade of insults. And it is NEVER ok.

        Honestly though, I think the main problem is that this article is bad and aggressive, and the worse thing in it is the title : Why a guy who just insulted a whole groupe is not racist and should not apologise = so much for subtlety;  this sounds a lot like a settlement of account and the author should not be surprised it is getting such extreme reactions.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/YDPIHIGHY6Y6FF6T3PBFZMDFBQ huaxin

          Haha yeah, I think we aren’t that far off either… Definitely I can see why this article would appear insulting to you.

          The definition of racism – let’s not get into that, I don’t think it can be really discussed and agreed upon here. What Tiger JK said was offensive, true.

          But in good conscience, I have to point out what I think was overlooked from most people who are reading the article. It’s not a “settlement of accounts”, more like talking about the problems with calling Tiger JK racist.  As Amy said:

          “Korean media and and the English-language K-pop blogosphere are focusing
          their energies onto the wrong thing by calling Tiger JK racist,
          commenting on how he went on an angry tirade, and pointing the
          conversation away from the guys who demanded the horse dance from him. They and their mindset are the problem”.

          You can say that he’s generalizing, true. But how about what was said to him? What does that speak of the culture those hecklers came from, coupled with the stereotypes of Asians we see in mainstream media and knowledge of how Asians are treated? It’s not that we should protect Tiger JK because he spoke up for racism before… It’s that he is also the victim of racism here, and this racism speaks to a greater societal problem of racism. Pervasive, hurtful racism towards a specific race of people.

          Call him wrong if you wish. But also acknowledge the cultural and societal implications – namely, the greater presence of racism towards (in this case) Asians present.

          Anyway thanks for clarifying and replying :)

          • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

             But i do ! As I said somewhere else in this thread, if he had not reacted in such a moronic way I would be the first to say something. But he has, and people who chose to violently insult others on Twitter always lose. So he lost. Honestly there are no winners here. Everyone is as moronic as the other. The whole story honestly looks like a less than glorious bickering between egoistic and angry males. But I would be less than willing to discuss societal implications who will paint themselves an antiracist persona and then loses it completely. That being said he apologised. Everyone makes mistakes. So there you go, it;s not then end of the world. The article though seems to think it’s a brilliant idea to pick up another fight. Well done.

      • destinyanglin

        Oh my goodness I love everything about your reply. This should be put up as the first post just so those trying to come in making the same arguments (as the person you replied to) get a better picture of where this stemmed from and why what he did was different than what the hecklers did.

        • Claire

          Lol, thank you. We happened to be able to perfectly dialogue you know. I don’t have a better picture, i have a different picture. You know, opinions, nuances.

        • peachstem

          I’m pretty sure we can read just fine, thanks.

          It’s a discussion blog, we should be allowed to make whatever arguments we want without other people having to judge us as ignorant people who don’t get the “better picture.” Oh please.

  • http://twitter.com/RoknRollPumpkin E-Bone

    “Tiger JK, who has nothing to do with Psy, who has nothing to do with “Gangnam Style,” who has nothing to do with anything related to this phenomenon, other than the sole fact that he is Asian like Psy is Asian. And in the minds of those hecklers, JK and Psy are probably interchangeable because of they are both Asian, and that is racist.”
    ^THIS. And I’m not surprised that people getting butthurt over his response has overshadowed the actual issue. So, instead of counting the number of readers which the point of this whole piece will most likely do back-flips over, I’ll simply applaud you for breaking it down so well :)

  • http://www.facebook.com/justine.jones.71 Justin Jones

    regardless of whether or not his comments were racist, the apology is necessary.

    just b/c you are/have been victim of racism does not entitle you/excuse you from making hateful comments and generalizing individuals of a certain race… all the more so in Tiger’s case when he is such an advocate against judging people based on their race…

    and contrary to article’s views, Tiger JK IS in a position of power…. maybe not in the Asian vs. ‘White Folk’ sense, but as an individual… He is the one standing on the stage with mass following and he is the one in position of influence over his audience… asian vs. white does not apply here… so Tiger JK did make racist comments and was hypocritical…

    i wonder if the author of this article would still excuse Tiger JK from being racist if the hecklers had been say, Somalian or Mexican, and he had made the same tirade against ‘somalian or mexican folk’…

    • http://evacuatewithstyle.org/blog Amy

      No, I wouldn’t have excused him if the hecklers were Somalian or Mexican, because he would have been racist. Asians as a group are stratified to be in positions of more power than Somalians or Mexicans. If Tiger JK was derogatory towards hecklers of Somalian or Mexican descent, he would have been racist, no doubt about it. But he is not being racist against the white hecklers because he is Asian and has no power over white as a group.

      • http://www.facebook.com/justine.jones.71 Justin Jones

        don’t you think your reasoning only serves to perpetuate the ‘we minorities are always victims’ mentality which only gives the more ‘powerful’ whites, some of whom are unfortunately very ignorant/narrow minded, their validation to treat Asians as the minority/victim?

        it doesn’t matter what race is making the racially based tirade or what race provoked it.

        and how are Asians not afforded with institutionalized/normalized power in the U.S.?

        just to list a few ex’s, doesn’t having Korean Americans like Harold Koh running the legal show in the U.S. State Department or having Chinese American like Steve Chu as U.S. Secretary of Energy, contradict with your reasoning that Asians have ‘no power over whites as a group’?

        Wouldn’t these men be accused of racism if they had said the same thing as Tiger JK?

        Bottom line:
        ANY hateful comment towards individuals of ANY race, whether generalized or not, is RACIST.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/YDPIHIGHY6Y6FF6T3PBFZMDFBQ huaxin

          @facebook-100003586152313:disqus : Have a few problems with your statement.

          1) The “We minorities are always victims mentality”. I… hope you’re not suggesting that it’s an unfortunate mentality that some minorities happen to have, and should discard because “oh it’s the world, the world always sucks, just suck it up and move on, show the ignorant whites you’re the better person”.

          Because that is ignoring the depth and persistence of institutionalized systems of power that discriminate against minorities. If someone keeps smacking your friend with a stick, do you tell the person to forget it and move on, or do you stop the person who wields the stick? Racism and discrimination hurts, and it has very real effects on the people it is perpetuated against. Job-seeking, house-hunting, social circles… you have so many aspects of a person’s life continuously being affected by these forces.

          It’s not that it’s wrong to say one shouldn’t make the best out a situation, but that you should recognize how hard it is to do so in the first place. Just brushing off the ‘victims mentality’ (I hate that term) is entirely condescending and takes the onus off the (in your words) ‘narrow-minded’, ‘ignorant whites’ to change.

          2) Institutionalized/normalized power is not the same as having a few minorities in key positions in the government. It’s about how they are treated in your culture. We have President Barack Obama as the first African-American president, but can you say that discrimination against African-Americans has ceased, or even significantly decreased, especially in areas like the South?

          I agree entirely with you that Tiger JK should have handled the situation better. But to call him racist and to say that he is hypocritical… I can’t agree with that, because that ignores entirely his experience with racism and discrimination.

          I think we’re all just looking at many points that are valid in this thread. It just depends on which one is more important to each individual. For some, Tiger JK was plain wrong because he cussed out all white people. I can understand how that would be offensive.

          But to others, the reasons behind him doing so are more important – simply that people were being racist to him in the first place. Therefore, him apologizing seems like he’s giving in and saying that yes, racism is unavoidable, I should have just pretended I didn’t hear and carried on, sorry for speaking out against it. Which is far, far, far, far, far more problematic.

          For me (obviously) I can see why he apologized, but I don’t like it at all, and I entirely dislike that people are calling him hypocritical because labelling him that seems to be an excuse to put aside the blatant racism that was displayed in the first place.

          Just my two cent’s worth…

        • http://evacuatewithstyle.org/blog Amy

          “just to list a few ex’s, doesn’t having Korean Americans like Harold Koh
          running the legal show in the U.S. State Department or having Chinese
          American like Steve Chu as U.S. Secretary of Energy, contradict with
          your reasoning that Asians have ‘no power over whites as a group’?”

          That’s the equivalent of saying, “I have a Black friend. I can’t be racist. [does something racist]”

          Consider this: In proportion to how many Asians and Asian Americans there are living in America, is the percentage of those who hold higher office proportional to the Asian/Asian American population? That is a big fat, “Hell no.”

          Asians — and it’s probably more accurate to specify *East* Asians — are afforded a higher power in the States than other minority groups. I pointed out as such in my first comment to you. But they are not afforded a higher power than whites.

          • Mike Newcomb

            First of all, the U.S. has a ruling class.  That truly isn’t deniable and the vast majority of people could not break into it regardless of their race.  Let’s not take this to the illuminati level, but I think the statement is reasonable.

            So I would answer your question with questions.

            What are the percentages of Asians / Asian Americans living in the U.S. and how does that map to percentages holding elected office?  To be fair, this can only count those who are eligible to vote.

            What are the approximate voter turnouts? 

            How does that map to their representation in office?

            How does that map to pockets of population?  You can’t take millions of folks in California and map that to demographic representation in Nebraska.

            How many Asian Americans have run for political office and what are their success rates?

            Do you have that data to support your assertions?  I don’t necessarily disagree with them, just curious how you decide it as fact.

            And to piss you off, at some point if you are a U.S. citizen you need to drop the prefix.  There is nothing wrong with being proud of ones heritage, but this used to be a melting pot and not a bento box.

          • km313

            It doesn’t do much good to list off specific individuals from minority groups that happen to hold positions of power in an attempt to say that said racial group has power over whites (in fact, you won’t hear many of those individuals in power saying anything remotely related to race relations or racism at all).
            Having a minority president in the U.S. has not changed the fact that race relations in this country are still tense, stereotypes still exist, and prejudice is still exercised. It’s naive to think otherwise.

            It’s not about victimizing anyone. It’s about the race with power being conscious of inherent privilege vs. acting like every racial group is on the same playing field. The fact is Tiger JK is entitled to be frustrated and to vent his frustrations because of not having that inherent privilege.

      • http://twitter.com/amionne92 Ami-ah

        According to the definition of racism that you perceive to be correct, Tiger JK was not racist but he was prejudiced. So does that still make it okay? Does that still mean that he doesn’t have to apologize?

        While his feelings were certainly justified and those hecklers were definitely racist, I think an apology was still appropriate Being a minority doesn’t give a person the right to be prejudiced towards another person. Plus, he’s representing his country at this event. Even in the face of blatant disrespect, he shouldn’t have went off like that on Twitter.

        He definitely could have gone about it in a better way.

      • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

        You do realise that by starting to quote examples -Somalian, Mexicans etc. you are starting to enter an even more divise and dangerous place where people rank in terms of perceived inferiority/superiority ? (according to your standards, which are never going to be universal). What’s next ? Should we rank the categories in which races, or communities or nationalities (because honestly at this stage I dont even know what exactly the article was treating) are faring better and are therefore authorised to be racist towards another group ?

        Say If I am a certain colour and I gain a certain amount of recognition in my area, I get to be called a racist, whereas If I am being looked down upon in this area (Tiger JK being Asian and doing hip hop) then it’s ok for me to be all heinous ? Because as long as you keep it vague, that may work but then again : how fun would it be to have that kind of discussion ? Should a Mexican who is being racist towards a Somalian be called  a racist ? Should the contrary not apply ? Oh, but if it was towards a Black person who is North American then how is it ? I dont even remember anymore if by groups you mean colour, race or country to be honest….

        All I know is that you’re opening the Pandora’s box the same way Tiger JK did.
        By the way, it may be of interest to you that when Great Britain ruled Ireland they had built a whole racial system in which Irish people were considered a lesser race based on the size of their skills and their supposed lesser developped skull . They were called “Hibernians”, and even given a Latin name to make it sound fancy and scientific. British people were the oppressors but Irish people were well white, and they were well trampled on for centuries, denied their culture and religion and so on. Skin colour is not a universal way of calculating superiority or creating racism, it seems. And also, do Irish people get  a badge for oppressed nation street cred, despite the colour of their skin ? Should we do that ? Should we start thrilling discussions on how some people have the right to crap on others and under which circumstances ? I think the guy crossed the line, especially for someone who is being all about the world being colourblind.

        • jessoa

          The British were racist to the Irish and settled Irish people are racist to Irish Travellers

          http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2012/0927/1224324469927.html
          This is racism even though travellers are white. Europeans are very racist to romani too. They don’t have white privilege. The articles the writer linked to are from an american viewpoint and don’t cover all situations

          • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

            well exactly. It appears pretty obvious to olde Europeans I guess :-)

          • jessoa

             If I was a traveller or romani I’d be hurt by all these articles saying I didn’t experience racism. Don’t american poc realize that by putting all white people in the world in one group and calling them privileged because of their race, they are denying the racism that some white people experience?

          • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

            I know right. there is always this thing that is worth remembering that America does not = The World. There is also someone out there speaking about “Whiteness”. Apparently White people have a group attitude. I personally have no clue what this is. is this is a disease and if yes, do I have it ?

  • http://www.facebook.com/justine.jones.71 Justin Jones

    Author: “Reverse racism does not exist”

    Are you serious? So just b/c black people are not as high in positions of power as whites, will you excuse black people of racisms if they commit racial hate crimes against whites?

  • http://twitter.com/rentrule12 ana

     Though tiger jk is human he is a celebrity and a public figure. For example if you have never been to a political rally
    it gets bad. Hecklers that tiger jk face are nothing compare to say
    President Obama who have to defend his race, religion, and his place of
    birth. You never hear him going on a rant. He has a right to be a loose canon too. I understand these too are two different people but there are both public figure and people admire and respect them.

  • http://twitter.com/SrilathaR Srilatha Rajamani

    I can understand why Tiger JK exploded. We humans cannot completely compartmentalize our public selves from our private experience, and Tiger seems to have dealt with a lot of hurt stemming from racial issues.But I think there were ways he could have made his point without losing his cool. He was right but his reaction was wrong.

    I can recall two incidents; related to performance interruption, though not racism; one of which I experienced directly and one that I read about in the news..

    I was seeing James Corden’s play on Broadway in the summer. Despite reminders about cell phones prior to, and ironically, during the play, someone’s cellphone rang in the middle of the scene. After ignoring it for a couple of seconds, the actors stopped, and Mr. Corden in complete good humor addressed the audience and said “Did we not just talk about this?”He then went on to make a joke, the audience laughed. After graciously defusing the awkward scene, he and the actors resumed the play.

    The other incident happened at New York Philharmonic and I read about it. A cellphone rang for a considerable time during a rendition of Mahler’s Ninth Symphony and the conductor Maestro Alan Gilbert just stopped the concert. After directly asking the owner to turn it off, he addressed the audience “Usually, when there’s a disturbance like this, it’s best to ignore it,”
    he said. “But this was so egregious that I could not allow it.” 

    The hecklers in Tiger’s concert were ignorant folk and a nuisance. It was perfectly OK for him to stop the concert and call for the authorities to escort these people out. It was OK for him to address racism and stereotyping with the audience. But the way in which he reacted was not OK. We expect more from him becuse we respect him. And in that venue, he was also acting as his nation’s cultural ambassador. This is why I am glad he apologized.

    Re Psy, there will ignorant folk who will stereotype him and Asians. Just as we cannot generalize Asian musicians based of Gangnam Style, we also cannot put Psy in a pedestal and make him the Asian Music God. Stereotyping works both ways and the K-POP movers and shakers should also be wary of putting this burden on Psy.

    We cannot control the actions of ignorant folk, but we can, through our own actions, dispel this ignorance and shed light on the truth.

  • GaCaRa

    That’s crime fueled by prejudice.

  • http://www.callmepatricia.com Patricia

    “Reverse racism does not exist. Until the majority of white people experience being enslaved, denied rights, deproted, denied housing, denied benefits, assigned mental health diangonses based on the colour of their skin, stopped and searched more times than they can count, having to justify their culture, having their culture appropriated each and every day, having their children being made live with the knowledge that they will be oppressed no matter what their parents do for them, treated as ‘animals,’ being called violent, being asked ‘does your culture allow you to do that?’ because you’re brown, having the worldwide ideal of beauty being everything that, physically, POC are not and finally, being killed daily, in plain sight, within the inherent structure within legal and societal systems for years and years because of the colour of their skin, white people can never claim ‘reverse racism.'”

    This, alongside many other very useful and informative articles can be found in the link that Amy posted at the end of the article — which, by the looks of things, might be worth a perusal for some of y’all.

    • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

      I am not sure I understand. Does that link imply that people have no right to feel offended or simply let down ? Or that what he said was ok?  This is an innocent question, but I ‘m afraid this article is meant more as a discussion on race with Tiger JK as a case study. The links seem to point to that and kind of seems to suggest it is ok to insult groups as a whole, since there are oppressors. I think I’m out of this conversation thread now. It does not seem to be too dialogue-friendly.

  • Jane Doe

    Great post, I agree completely. I always laugh at people who try to use that “He is a public figure” excuse. He is a rapper and artist, not a freaking politician. The idea that everyone in the public eye should suddenly become saints is ridiculous. 

    • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

      ahaha, no one is asking him to be a saint, but next time he speaks against racism in general he might want to….not to.

  • soluiz

    I’m Asian and after reading the article, esp the provided link, i realised how shallow I am towards racism. I always just accept it like it’s the norm and never felt any hatred or inferiority towards another race. Thus never understands when come across race topics on the net. I sincerely felt that people are just being over sensitive and some are being reverse-racist. Guess I’m pretty lucky to be born in my generation and brought up like I was.
    Though i understood why tigerjk snapped thus being irrational. I also just understood it as an anger problem rather than a burden being on the receiving end of racism. My bad

  • hanje

    I hate the fact that he had to apologize and that he called himself a reverse racist (ugh reverse racism does not exist and idc how many white ppl say that it does and recount experiences they’ve had where they’ve been bullied because they were too “white”. it’s /not/ racism. yes it sucks that you’ve suffered because you were white or whatever but it’s more prejudice than it is racism) but everything else he said was on the point and i’m happy that someone in the public eye finally said something like this.

  • http://twitter.com/DeniseHuxxtable S☀L

    I agree wholeheartedly with this article.  But I’m sure it’s going to go over people’s heads. It’s really easy for people to dismiss things that they don’t understand or experience rather than taking the time to explore and understand another person’s perspective.

  • http://twitter.com/lily_of_west Majin Buu

    The amount of bullshit in this article is baffling. Tiger JK was as racist as the “white boys” who started this shit. If they were ignorant enough to be racist towards him, Tiger JK who has been dealing with racism his whole life and who has been advocating against racism half of his life, should have known better. I don’t care what you say, he was being racist in that moment because he insulted an entire race. He didn’t say “you white boys right there, yes you the ones telling me to do the horse dance, fuck you” he said “fuck all the white people”. This my friends is racism. If he felt the need to apologize because he realized he was being racist, and if he himself said “And I am not proud of being racist towards white people.” who are all of you to come here and say “he shouldn’t have apologized” and “he was not being racist”. If there’s one thing I hate more than racism, it would be double standards. One person showing prejudice towards another person (or in this case a whole fucking bunch of people) on account of the color of their skin, is being racist as fuck. He fucked up, he realized that, he apologized and I respect him for taking the responsibility for what he had said. Do I understand the place he was coming from, yes, but that still doesn’t justify the way he went about it. You do not fight ignorance with more ignorance, you do not fight sexism with more sexism, you do not fight prejudice with more prejudice and you sure as fuck don’t fight racism and racist people with more racism. Period!

    • cappuccinotooda

      did you read the entire article? Racism isn’t just about insulting someone or simply “hating” another race (technically we are all one race, just different ethnicities)….I really think we throw the word racist around too often without understanding what the word actually means.

      • http://twitter.com/lily_of_west Majin Buu

        Yes, I read the entire article, and just because “racism isn’t just about insulting someone or simply “hating” another race” doesn’t mean what he did wasn’t racist at that moment.

        And again why are we even discussing this if the man had enough sense (which is what most people here are lacking from what I perceive) to say “yes I was racist and I apologize for it”, why is anyone giving themselves the right to come and say “no he didn’t need to apologize and no he wasn’t being racist”.

        The color of your skin doesn’t excuse you from being racist. I was offended on a personal level, I did see it as a racist comment, I was disappointed in him, but at least he knew that he fucked up and he owned up to it. Which is more than I can say about some people here. I will not hold this against him because I know he is not a racist person in general, but I will never go back on my opinion that he was being racist at that moment. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, This is mine and I stand behind it. But it makes me sad that in the 21st century people are making excuses for other people who are being racist just because they’re not white.

        And no this is not about me being a thickheaded white person, I would have had the same opinion if Tiger JK was a white or black person screaming these slurs at other races. Racism might not be just “hating on another race” but it sure as hell is a big ass part of it.

        • cappuccinotooda

          I do believe that Tiger JK was pretty rude and I’m not saying he shouldn’t have apologized but he wasn’t being a racist. Minorities can say stuff but because they technically have no power in a white dominated society, their words are basically ineffective in the bigger picture. Racism is prejudice/discrimination plus power and Tiger JK (who was heckled because other’s generalized his asian background) used words that were racially based but ultimately he doesn’t have any umph in the words. I mean, when someone says something mean, we do feel hurt/insulted but in the end it wouldn’t really change anything for those who have the power.

          However, I am NOT saying it gives minorities an excuse to say racially based comments to others. 

          I could go on but I’m not the best at expressing my words and I know I can’t convince you in changing your opinion, so I’ll stop.  We have different opinions but I enjoyed reading your side to this article. 

          • http://twitter.com/lily_of_west Majin Buu

            No, that’s just one of the definitions of racism, not everyone agrees with that definition and not everyone holds on to it like a holy scripture, like people here seem to.

            I might be white but I’ve experienced one form of prejudice all my life, racism is a form of prejudice and to me he was being racist in that moment. Prejudice in any way shape or form is inexcusable.

            He could have worded his rant differently but he didn’t, he said “fuck ALL the white people”. To me that was a racist comment and I felt it on a personal level. You say he was just being rude and that I just feel hurt, but I say he was being racist and I felt that as a racist comment.

            But like I said, I’m not holding it against him because he did realize he was wrong and he did apologize, which is something people here seem to skip through like it doesn’t even matter.

            And I feel the same, we should just agree to disagree.

          • http://twitter.com/logton11 Jasmin Davis

            Did you read the article? Did you forget where he was performing? He was in a concert in Seoul, Korea, where Koreans are the majorities and dominate the Korean society. Yet you say that Tiger JK, being a Korean of the majority, was *not* being racist towards a few white hecklers, who by race are the minorities in Korea.

            The most basic definition of racism is the stereotyping of an individual by race, it does not involve power in society. It’s racist to even suggest that because of him being Asian(and thus the minority in your words) wasn’t being racist, or rather could not be racist because of his race. It does not matter what societal class you are in or how much power your race is: when you stereotype a person based on the color of their skin that is the definition of **racism**. It doesn’t matter how much ‘umph’ he has in his words. It does not matter what race he his. 

            When you stereotype, discriminate, or even assume something of an individual’s merit based on their skin color, you are being racist.

  • straighttohelvetica

    Readers reactions to what Tiger JK said is the perfect proof of how his comments weren’t racist. I notice no one who’s upset really cares that what he said was true. It’s true that Asian men are portrayed as comedic foils or martial arts experts in Western media; it’s true that Hollywood is notorious about whitewashing stories about people of color or completely co-opting them and making them their own (example, the romanticized schlop that was “The Help”); and that it’s probably true that the only reason Psy got the attention he did was because he’s a slightly chubby Asian man doing a stupid dance. All of that truth got obscured because, OMG, JK may have implied all white people are the same. 

    We’re not talking about the inequality that Tiger JK pointed out or the asshole behavior of the audience members, who ultimately are responsible for this mess. We’re trying to decide if Tiger JK himself is racist because of what he said. People are completely missing the point because, once again, the discussion of a community gets sidetracked to what white people are going through.

    What he said may have been tactless and ill-timed, but it wasn’t racist. What he said will in no way take power or a voice away from white people. Hell, if no one thinks all white people are racist after listening to Chelsea Handler, Sarah Silverman or Daniel Tosh, I sincerely doubt Tiger JK can sway them. His comments made some people feel bad. Hurt feelings does not equate to racism. 

    Tiger JK was invited to perform at an event that had nothing to do with Psy. He’s not Psy, his music sounds nothing like Psy’s and there is no other reason to conflate the two, except for the fact they are the same race and nationality. No matter how upset his off the cuff remarks may have made you feel, you will get over it. He can’t really hurt you. However, I bet this time next year, there still won’t be a Hollywood movie with an Asian male lead or a sitcom with an all-Asian cast. Let’s see how long it takes him and other entertainers of color to get over that.

    • Mike Newcomb

      If the question is simply is Tiger JK a racist because of his comments, it is a pretty simple test – if it had been anyone of any other race would he have focused on it?  Or was his anger tied to the color of the commenters?  If they were black teenagers would his response have been the same?  Would he have been annoyed at the request, probably.  Would he have been focused on their skin?  well that is the question isn’t?

      Honestly, that shouldn’t be part of the equation.  I am going to site the movie Step Brothers here – at the f*cking catalina wine mixer, there is a billy joel cover band that only does one era of joel music.  Several audience members demand other songs.  Singer freaks out.  Sounds pretty familiar…

      To take that further, why does anyone actually care what Tiger JK thinks about race relations?  Seriously?  

      Is his opinion valid because he’s famous? Or does that just drive ad revenue? hmmm…

      • straighttohelvetica

        First a minor rant: I will never understand why people come to pop culture sites and then wonder why everyone is discussing pop culture. This is a site that deals with famous people: What they think, what they do, what they wear, etc. Some people actually care about what Tiger JK thinks about race relations because he’s an Asian man in hip-hop married to a biracial woman and father to a biracial son. He’s talked about race both in Korea and the U.S. His opinion isn’t more vaild, but it’s no less valid and, since he’s a public figure, more people are able to talk about and discuss his views than say their college professor’s.

        You’re Step Brotherd example isn’t relevant at all. Different eras of Billy Joel is still Billy Joel. Tiger JK is not Psy. 

        Last, black teenagers mocking Tiger JK with the Psy dance would have been racist. If Tiger JK had responded with similar stereotypes about black people, that would be racist. But, that’s not what happened. This hypothetical is a derailment. He said “eff you, white people.” He didn’t insult white people for who they are; he insulted what they do and the way they control the market. 

        • http://twitter.com/lily_of_west Majin Buu

          Being white is also who I am, and I have no control over the market, yet he still insulted me because he didn’t say “fuck white businessmen who control the market” or “fuck rich people who control the market” or “fuck you guys over there who keep telling me to do the horse dance, who happen to be white” he said “fuck ALL THE WHITE PEOPLE”

          BIG ASS DIFFERENCE!!!!

          • straighttohelvetica

            You know, I’d feel more sympathy if there weren’t entire industries devoted to proclaiming how great white people are (fashion, Hollywood, make-up, etc). 

            Stop looking for pats on the head and reassurances that you’re a good person. You knew who he was referring to and he explained why. 

            If it makes you feel better, replace “white people” with “whiteness.” “Whiteness” is that frame of mind that makes managers of entertainment companies and directors in Hollywood think that white is default. “Whiteness” is that nobody wants to see Asian/black/Hispanic actors/singers/entertainers. “Whiteness” is when people prove them right by complaining and making racist comments on Twitter when a character they thought was white is portrayed by an actor of color. 

            Again, nobody cares that what Tiger JK said was true. They’re just ranting over hurt feelings.

          • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

             Oh yes, some people do care about the truth of what he said. You should too, before fantasising about “whiteness.” This is not a toothpaste advertising.

          • http://twitter.com/lily_of_west Majin Buu

            So because I happen to be white, the same skin color as the “people who have the control over everything in the world, good and bad” I have no right to feel insulted, hurt or to call racism here??? Just because I know he was referring to those who started this shit, and those who do have the power doesn’t mean I don’t have the right to say he was being racist towards me, a white person, too. Because he was. I repeat he didn’t say “fuck you guys saying I should do the horse dance” or “fuck those white people with power who make these stereotypes on daily basis” he said “FUCK ALL THE WHITE PEOPLE” that’s called generalizing and being racist towards an entire race!

            So a white person saying “fuck all the black people” or “fuck all the brown people” or “fuck all the Asian people” it’s racism but a black or Asian person saying “fuck all the white people” isn’t?

            Oh I see how this works.

            It’s called being stupid and ignorant as fuck and having double standards. And no it doesn’t make me feel better to replace “white people” with “whiteness” and I don’t know why it should. I can’t apologize for what white people did or keep doing just because I’m white too. I can only take responsibility for my actions and words. As a person living in the 21st century. As everyone should no matter the race, sex or religion. As Tiger JK did, he took responsibility for what he said and how he acted and people saying he shouldn’t have are showing how ignorant and racist they are.

            And honey I ain’t looking for a pat on the head from anyone, especially not racist people who come here supporting one form of racism claiming they’re not being racist.

          • straighttohelvetica

            I never said you didn’t have a right to be hurt; I just said I have no sympathy. And I also didn’t say it wasn’t hurtful; I said it wasn’t racist. People have explained it over and over in the post and the comments and there are still people who don’t get it or who want to act like what Tiger JK goes through in the entertainment industry is the same as him saying “eff, white people.”

            Whiteness is relevant because while you as white person may not do those things, you benefit from it. You can pretend like you don’t, but when you turn on the TV, what is presented as the norm? White people, white values, etc. 

            I’m not a racist; I just don’t have patience for white people who are so self-absorbed they shout racism so loud that they can’t see the real acts when it happens.

          • http://twitter.com/lily_of_west Majin Buu

            I clicked like instead of reply. But whatever. And I said it was, and Tiger JK himself said he was, so let’s just leave it at we can agree to disagree. You say “not racist” I say “bullshit”!

            I didn’t say Tiger JK goes around saying that, I said he was racist at that moment, which he himself confirmed and somehow even with that, some of you don’t want to admit it. But hey to each his own.

            And I do not benefit from anything you mentioned because I do not turn on my TV and think “oh my this girl is beautiful because she’s white” nor do I think “oh my this guy is sexy because he’s black”.  I do not function like that nor was I brought up like that.

          • straighttohelvetica

            You’re either purposely being thick or trolling. Either way, I’m done having to repeat the same points over and over.

          • http://twitter.com/lily_of_west Majin Buu

            When you accept that you are being racist we can talk about me being thick, ok?

          • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

            Wow, calm down, maybe.

          • Mike Newcomb

            Please clearly define white values and how the differentiate from other color values.

            Shows on major television are determined by market research for dollar spend wrt advertising.

            The second that studios believe that sitcoms starring pygmy albinos living in leper colonies will generate the most revenue, then that is what will be seen on television.

            Of course, that is still “white” culture, right?

          • straighttohelvetica

            “The second that studios believe that sitcoms starring pygmy albinos living in leper colonies will generate the most revenue, then that is what will be seen on television.”

            I didn’t realize wanting to see more PoC on TV was equivalent to a pygmy leper colony. I will make note of that.

            Have you been to a black church? A black hair salon? An Chinese language school? A quinceanera? Aspects of these culture differ from white culture. Why you’re acting like that is a big surprise is beyond me.

          • Mike Newcomb

            Again straw man.

            The pygmy comment was used to illustrate that the motivations are not tied to the color of any culture, they are tied to dollars, nothing more.  Thank you for proving my point.

            I have visited all of the items in question and more. Sure there are differences.  The same as an Irish pub, an Italian deli, a synogague, etc.

            Please define white culture.

          • straighttohelvetica

            I’m not Google nor am I your damn teacher. That link Amy included at the bottom of her post is full of info. I didn’t know what Lynard Skynard was (hey, an example of white culture!); I looked it up myself.

            If dollars proved anything, why did the movie directors of Avatar replace all the Asian characters of the cartoon with white kids? The show was already popular and already making money.

            Honestly, I’m over this whole argument. Good thing all these white people were here or I’d never know what racism was. =D

          • peachstem

            @straighttohelvetica:disqus 

            I’m not white but you seriously seem to be very bitter towards them as a group.

            I don’t understand how minorities, myself being Asian, complain about racism and ignorance and yet aren’t willing to inform and discuss these topics with other races without reacting irrationally and feeling defensive.

            “I’m not Google nor am I your damn teacher. That link Amy included at the bottom of her post is full of info. I didn’t know what Lynard Skynard was (hey, an example of white culture!); I looked it up myself.”

            You need to cool it, bro.

          • Mike Newcomb

            Nope, no one goes to see Usher, Beyonce, Jay z, Denzel Washington, Nicki Minaj, Lil Wayne, Jessica Alba, Selma Hayek, Antonio Banderas, etc.  

            As an aside, many people would argue that “Hollywood” is controlled by an ethnic group that doesn’t identify itself with the rest of the white population.

            And to be honest, hollywood is actually run by analytics.  They calculate a venture’s success based on genre, target audience (always 15-25 yr olds), and the level of cast they can attach based on expected budget.  They don’t say that Tom Cruise is white, Cuba Gooding Jr is black – go with Tom.  They look at historical revenue and say that people of all demographic are more likely to see a Tom Cruise movie.

            Microsoft Excel and that damn white privilege.
            If Blade was played by Chris Hemsworth instead of Wesley Snipes, wouldn’t that have had some complaint? I’ll say again that if you view everything through a lens of racism, then everything you see will contain it. I think people are complaining about established characterization vs. color.  You know lots of people complained about the casting of the male love interest in the Hunger Games.  He didn’t “look” like people thought the character should look based on the established descriptions that the movie is emulating.I thought Daniel Craig was an odd choice for James Bond, as he didn’t have the same “feel” that the other actors gave the role.  Is it because I am against blonde people or I had an established image of a character that I couldn’t picture the actor in?I think it is quite a straw man to take every point that you don’t agree with as being “ranting over hurt feelings”.

          • RC_RC

             “nobody wants to see Asian/black/Hispanic actors/singers/entertainers…”
            That is one of the biggest lies i have ever read. 

          • straighttohelvetica

            I’m over butt-hurt white people trying to derail this thread. Go start shit with someone else.

          • RC_RC

            I’m sorry but I’m allowed to say something too here. Why is disagreeing always equaled to being butt-hurt?

          • peachstem

            I must have missed the memo where Will Smith was a blockbuster actor and Salma Hayek is a sex symbol and respected actress.

          • straighttohelvetica

            In response to what you previously wrote, first, do not scold me. You have no idea who I am or what I deal with. 

            As to your point, I’m not Mike Newcomb’s teacher. I went back and forth enough with him to learn he was grown enough to have a father-in-law. He wasn’t asking questions because he was actually curious, he wanted to argue. Once I realized that, I put a stop to the conversation. 

            Second, if I sound bitter, it’s because I am. Or at least frustrated. I spent an hour or two trying to converse with people on this thread about how yes, what Tiger JK said was hurtful, but, no, it wasn’t racist. I was plenty patient and willing to talk. But people kept picking at straws, derailing the conversation or invalidating what people said. I didn’t cuss or get short with people until after I was cussed at. 

            Also, I don’t have a problem with white people. I just have a problem the attitude and with the arrogance of many of the people who responded here. The definition of racism cited in the article is one that has been defined by numerous sociologists and psychologists. It’s one many people agree with. To come up and say it’s all bullshit, argue with people and call them racist because they agree with that definition is arrogance, especially since I doubt those people bothered to actually read the resources on racism that were suggested.

            I never once said Tiger JK was completely in the right in what he did; I actually at one point called it tactless, inappropriate and ill-timed. But, I didn’t and still don’t see it as racist. Two white boys heckled him and he blew up. (People seem to keep forgetting that they are the ones who instigated this.) Again, his outburst was tactless, ill-timed and maybe even hurtful. But it’s not racist. If I smack a child, that’s abuse. If a child smacks me, it’s not. It depends on the power and the privilege the population has.

            I was angry because at the end of this whole mess, Tiger JK’s own hurt about what he’s gone through got eclipsed because he said something vaguely insulting about white people. (If “fuck you” was the worst insult I heard said about black people, I’d actually be relieved. Instead, we get nooses, comparisons to monkeys, the n-word and more. Which is why I’m not that sympathetic.) 

            All of the upset people in this thread will get over what he said. I know they will. Tiger JK cannot take their jobs, physically intimidate them, etc. However actors and entertainers of color are still facing barriers. And it’s sad to see that to some people in this thread, that’s not as important as someone yelling “fuck white people” in a fit of anger.

            As for this comment, you’re taking my words out of context. I wrote that as an example of white privilege, the thinking of big studios and entertainment companies. Studios often use that excuse to not hire actors of color. They state that people don’t want to see black/Asian/Hispanic actors. That’s why movies like the Last Airbender get whitewashed and stories about people of color get told from a white POV (such as “The Help.”) I never said there were no famous black/Asian/Hispanic entertainers. But compare the number of actors of color most audiences know versus the number of white actors they know and you can see the discrepancy. Disney still makes animated features with all white casts. Jessica, Tiffany, Jay Park and others had to go to Korea to become famous singers. I sincerely hope this is not something you will deny.

          • peachstem

            I just typed out a complete response but my computer shut down on me. Whatever.

            “…Tiger JK’s own hurt about what he’s gone through got eclipsed because he said something vaguely insulting about white people.”

            Maybe you can try addressing the author instead because what the title calls for is “why he shouldn’t have apologized” – that’s why so many people are focusing on his reaction instead of the hecklers themselves. Perhaps the writer should take note of that so in the future, discussions in the comment section can be guided better. You can’t blame people for addressing what the article ITSELF addresses.

            “All of the upset people in this thread will get over what he said. I know they will. Tiger JK cannot take their jobs, physically intimidate them, etc.”

            You are making assumptions and trying to “eclipse” other people’s feelings and opinions. Unless a lot of people here want to go to Korea to become a rapper, I doubt Tiger JK will take their jobs. He cannot “physically intimidate them” where he lives, as he’s part of the majority in South Korea who btw aren’t very friendly to foreigners.

            “You have no idea who I am or what I deal with.”

            Likewise, you do not personally know Jessica, Tiffany or Jay Park. Stop using them as examples to fit into your argument of racism in the American media. I’m not denying that it happens, but some of your evidence is lacking. Jessica was scouted and signed with SM when she was 10-11 (her sister too, at even a younger age). Do you REALLY think she or her sister thought about “making it in the US is going to be hard because I’m Asian” at her age? She wasn’t FORCED or “HAD to go to Korea to become a famous singer” – like you are trying to label her as – if she was scouted by chance.

            Asians will NOT automatically accept each other because they are part of the “same race.” It’s NOT that easy. Sure, they went to SK to try their luck but it’s not much better than trying in America. Korean Americans are considered almost just as foreign as any other outsider. Jay Park, who spent most of his childhood in the US and barely speaks Korean, is just as American or “white” as anyone else. It’s even worse for him because he’s expected to “know Korean culture” just because he looks the part. Chinese or Japanese artists in the Kpop industry are put on the backburner compared to their Korean counterparts. At this point it’s no different than trying to make it in the US. It’s rather insulting to assume that “Asian” means a golden ticket to the Kpop industry, especially considering the discrimination and treatment that SE Asian/non-Korean/Korean Americans/half-Koreans face by native Koreans.

            I respect your perspective and you made some great points, but I think you should consider alternative ones too. Korea is no longer the place to go to “if people are being racist towards Asians in your home country” (I don’t believe it ever was). I have heard MANY personal accounts from people who would audition for a Kpop company just to experience the Korean culture until their contract is up. The Kpop industry is looking attractive in itself to a LOT of people. Depending on who you talk to, it might be even offensive to assume that people are going to a second-rate country (compared to America) because they have no other choice. For example, I’m Asian and if I wanted to debut in Korea for no other reason than to meet and work with very talented people who just happen to be living in an Asian country, I would NOT appreciate other people labelling me as “running away from America because I can’t ever make it as an Asian.” Some people go to Korea because they WANT to be there (like many expats who are there today) – racializing their motivations and interests is misleading.

          • straighttohelvetica

            Thanks for replying. I admit the Jessica, Tiffany and Jay Park comment was a poor example and I didn’t mean to imply they “ran away” to South Korea. I was looking more at their popularity in South Korea versus the States. (i.e. The comments people made when SNSD appeared on David Letterman.) One of the reasons I’m not super excited about k-pop idols breaking into the Western market, is that I don’t want to see them talked about the way some Twitter users talked about that performance.

        • Mike Newcomb

          On the topic of Tiger JK, does his background make him right?  That was what was meant.  Why does his opinion have more weight than anyone else?  Charlie Sheen has done lots of drugs, should he set drug policy.

          Step brother example was an attempt to show some humor, as i think this is an important issue and it can be easy for discussions to turn into arguments.

          Take a broader look at it though – did the kids (who seem like jerks) confuse all asians as the same or did they say that these are both korean musicians?  Still disrespectful to the artist but without a purely racial connotations.  They are relating genres, as the Billy Joel example.

          Let me make it more personal.  My father in law is a musician who plays in lots of bars and small clubs.  He regularly has people heckle him to play Skynard or Bon Jovi.

          They aren’t his style of music, and all that he is in common is being white and having a guitar.  Was that racially motivated or ignorant assholes wanting genre related entertainment?

          I would argue with the black teens, that you could go on the same rant. Jay Z has a tremendous influence on what is deemed popular music in the U.S.

          And I will take one more bullet, and ask who was the first Western celebrity of note who pimped Psy?

          Mr. Tpayne.

          Now if the entire argument that westerners do what is being said, then fine as a general statement it is legit.  That isn’t limited to one race in the west.

          • http://twitter.com/RoknRollPumpkin E-Bone

            Perhaps the issue is this: An extremely prominent and well respected Korean hip hop star was asked to shuck and jive for the entertainment of a couple of white spectators during a performance in his native country. I’d like to consider the possibility that they may have confused the him with Psy (if they didn’t have eyes), but I can’t. He’s not being granted expert status on anti-racism because of his background or popularity, but as a PoC, who are routinely ignored or are told they are overreacting in situations just like this. 

          • Mike Newcomb

            Maybe the issue is that heckling is a regular thing that happens to entertainers, and choosing to instead call the people in question assholes, he decided to target their entire race and then people want to claim that it wasn’t racist because the group attacked happened to be white?

            No one is saying that “people of color” are overreacting, what is being said is that “people who are white” aren’t allowed to be irritated when someone makes overtly racist statements and then said “people of color” defend the statements.

          • straighttohelvetica

            I wouldn’t let Charlie Sheen set any drug policy laws, but I would actually be interested in what he thought about it. (I probably would disagree, but I’d still think it would be interesting to see where he was coming from).

            In regards to your scenario involving your FIL, honestly, if the hecklers had requested anything other than Psy, I don’t think JK would have exploded like he did. The hecklers probably don’t know any other Korean artist. They didn’t ask him to perform a certain song by a certain group who makes music in a certain genre. They just wanted the horse dance.

            And T-Pain promoted Psy with his own video. He didn’t go up to completely different entertainer and ask them to perform the dance. I don’t think Psy’s popularity in itself is racist. It’s the fact that now he’s become the sole face of Asian entertainers that’s racist.

          • Mike Newcomb

            If the hecklers had asked Tiger to do the Sorry Sorry dance, he wouldn’t have been upset?  They asked for a performance by a performer.  Potato Potato.

            You don’t know anything about the hecklers.  It is very easy to say that they didn’t know any other artists. It is very easy for me to say that it is hard so see when you are on stage and I would not be surprised if the hecklers had a broader demographic blend.  See how easy that is?

            Now you are blending issues – My comment regarding T-pain is directed toward comments regarding Psy being popular in the west because white people laugh at asians.  T-pain is not white and was honestly the catalyst for his success.

  • Mike Newcomb

    How do you define the power structure?  If you took a purely macro view, a white person could never be considered racist by your definition (which is flawed, but we’ll cover that in a minute) as they are far and away a minority on this little planet called Earth.  

    On a micro scale (ie individual or small socio groups) those realities blend.  Let us keep with your flawed definition of the offender requiring power.  Doesn’t Mr. Tiger have power over the white kids in question?  He has a massive social following that made it easy for him to communicate his point and rally his sycophants, wouldn’t you say?

    Let’s also take your little article.  Wouldn’t you say, as a somewhat well read site (within the genre) that you have some aspect of power over an audience?  So we can use your flawed definition of racism and assign it to you, as you have generalized a pretty broad subset of people based on their lack of pigment.

    And I will agree, reverse racism doesn’t exist.  Because the definition of racism is forming beliefe and actions based on the race of an individual or group.  Nothing more. 

    If you are black and you dislike someone for the lone fact that they are asian –  that is racism.  If you are asian and dislike someone who is white because they are white, then that is racism (actually we could get in the argument of ethnicism vs. racism).  

    Let’s take this even further.  Racism isn’t purely a negative concept.  I could prefer hispanic women to white women.  I don’t have any negative feelings towards white women, it is just who I found more attractive.  I formed a generalized belief based on data limited to race.  

    Your addition of power doesn’t even break this model.  An individual has power over their own actions (on a micro scale), I can exert control by letting the white man cut me in line vs. the black woman, no?  Now if only let black women me in line but not white women, am I not racist?  Did I not make a choice based on superficial

    So the obvious retort will be that I don’t understand and I must be white.  You could be right, you could be wrong.  It is the internet, so pick which ever one assists in your response.

    My suggestion, is that the only way people will ever (it has been several thousand years to get to this point of tolerance, so let’s assume things aren’t going to change quickly) move past these silly designations is to stop drawing the lines yourself.  

    What I mean – if you think of every action and reaction as being predicated on race, then every action and reaction will be predicated on race.  Maybe you are the racist and you are seeing yourself in other people?  The mirror is a cruel mistress.

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/YDPIHIGHY6Y6FF6T3PBFZMDFBQ huaxin

      I guess the following paragraph is your main point?

      “My suggestion, is that the only way people will ever (it has been
      several thousand years to get to this point of tolerance, so let’s
      assume things aren’t going to change quickly) move past these silly
      designations is to stop drawing the lines yourself.

      What I mean – if you think of every action and reaction as being
      predicated on race, then every action and reaction will be predicated on
      race.  Maybe you are the racist and you are seeing yourself in other
      people?  The mirror is a cruel mistress.”

      So what about the white people in the audience who told him to “F rapping, just dance” because they saw him as an Asian performer and automatically associated him with Psy. To them all Asian performers are interchangeable with Psy. Anyone remember William Hung?

      Are you saying that racism is a “silly designation” and that we should stop assuming it exists – in your words “stop drawing the lines”? So there are no stereotypes associated with minorities, no systemic discrimination perpetuated against them? So it’s all just in our minds and we should stop seeing racism everywhere we turn? Because in your words, it’s us who “think of every action and reaction as being predicated on race”.

      So by your words the race issue doesn’t even come into this whole Tiger JK issue and we just, I dunno, made it up?

      • Mike Newcomb

        Reading comprehension is hard.  

        Several points –

        1) Reverse Racism = Racism.  They aren’t separate concepts, they are the same.  If you want to add power into the equation, then fine just think about levels of power – ie Government vs. the person interviewing you vs. how you treat people. 

        2) Yes, I think people breaking people down into groups based on color is a silly, useless practice.  Silly as in ridiculous.  That doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen and it doesn’t mean that it shouldn’t stop.  You read way to much into a fairly clear statement.  Does it seem ridiculous to you to assign entire profiles of behavior to people based on superficial pigment and bone structure combinations?

        3) For all of human existence people have practiced discrimination.  There isn’t a cultural group that is exempt.  It is 2012 AD and I would say the world is more tolerant than in 500 AD.  Would you disagree?  It has been a long period of time and it won’t go away anytime soon.

        4) The first step to stop people from doing things you don’t like, is to you know not do it yourself.  You can’t honestly be angry at someone for judging you based on the color of your skin, if you do it too.  Does that make sense?  It doesn’t mean allowing bad things to occur, but it does mean not processing everything that happens in life through that lens.
        5)  If the kids in question did as was said ( I wasn’t there and don’t know exactly what happened, do you?) then they are douche bags. Not everyone who is white is a douche bag.  So why is it that they are douche bags, because they are white?

        Did they associate an asian with all asians or did they associate a korean musician with a korean musician?  Not fair to the artist but very different connotations.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/YDPIHIGHY6Y6FF6T3PBFZMDFBQ huaxin

          Yeah, reading comprehension is certainly hard.

          1), 2), 3), 4), 5) – I don’t disagree with what you say. I didn’t have an issue with those points, and I still don’t. I’m glad you weren’t saying what I thought you were saying at first, thanks for clarifying.

          Could you clarify how the author is racialising this issue? Because I see that she’s pointing out how 1) racist insults against Tiger JK were made and 2) media coverage of this issue didn’t address the initial racist comments but instead focused on how he was racist.

          Racist stereotypes began and the issue of race continued to come up through media coverage of the issue. So this article simply asked about point 2) why did media coverage focus on ‘racist’ remarks JK made and not on the culture which gave rise to stereotypes that insulted JK?

          Definitely if we insist on seeing everything as race-based then we create our own problems. But how is this not an issue concerned with racism and stereotypes and culture?

          • Mike Newcomb

            It is possible to be insulted by things that aren’t insults.  It is possible to assign racist motivations to all acts.  You can do bad things to a person of another race and have it not be driven by race, no?

            So could the hecklers just be assholes and would harass a variety of artists in a variety of ways?  Or is it that white people are raised from birth to view all asians as sources of amusement?  The article leans towards the second statement.

            WRT to the coverage, it is pretty simple – 

            The focus was on Tiger JK because he was being recorded and continued the engagement.  That is very different from heckling and no one really cares about what someone does to a celebrity, we care about how the celebrity reacts.  That isn’t racially motivated, it just is.  So when a celebrity (in a documented manner) goes off, that will be the focus.

            To assign that a group of people (bloggers / media) only looked at the surface level as a racial issue is specious.  People always grab the headline and focus there.  Doing so in this instance is not racially motivated.  When you read an article in most publications, do you really feel that you had a complete examination of an issue?  Or did you get the sensationalist headline?

            The author also focused on how Psy was treated on shows as being how westerners (particularly white people) view asians solely as items of amusement.  

            Don’t you think that is somewhat of a stretch?  A goofy guy did a goofy song with a goofy dance and people think / treat it as goofy.

            I also really struggle to assign deeper meaning when comedy is involved.  Understand, that a big reason comedy works is because it crosses boundaries and does things that make people uncomfortable.  I don’t think the joke from Handler is an indication of western prejudice, I think it is a comedian going somewhere people didn’t expect.  I would site the careers of Richard Pryor, Eddie Murphy, and every other comedian that you have ever heard of.

            I would also suggest that you read the article that the author links to as reference.  It provides the context.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/YDPIHIGHY6Y6FF6T3PBFZMDFBQ huaxin

            Look, I think we should just agree to disagree… You feel that the issue isn’t racially motivated/concerns race because

            1) Hecklers could be insulting him not because they thought all Asians should do the horse dance. Maybe because they felt like it, who knows?

            – Have you seen the portrayal of asian men in hollywood? Check out this ABC news article. http://abcnews.go.com/Entertainment/story?id=771790&page=1#.UGoIu_ladJA
            I’m not saying the article is right because it’s from ABC/on the internet. Just that it expresses what I want to say more clearly.

            2) Media coverage “focused on him and his reaction”, therefore it was justified to call JK racist because he behaved in an unprofessional way and generalized white people.

            – I guess our definitions of racism are just different then. I just think that term should be used carefully and shouldn’t be used on Tiger JK here. 

            3) Asians aren’t represented “solely as items of amusement”, we are overthinking the matter because “a goofy guy did a goofy song with a goofy dance and people think/treat it as goofy”.

            – Yup, we could be. But again, in light of how minorities are represented in pop culture, not likely.

            I respect that you have your own point of view. Let’s agree to disagree then.

          • Mike Newcomb

            That’s fine.  I appreciate the discussion versus the desire to not at least consider other’s views.

            I think the main problem is that everyone has vastly different definitions of racism.

            I am more bewildered by some of the mental and verbal gymnastics used.

            I guess I use a literal definition as racism, not some convoluted version of it to justify behaviors that some here have.
            You treat someone in a particular manner based on no other factor than their race, it is an act of racism.  

            I don’t assign a positive or negative to that definition.  The acts associated receive that.

            How do you define it?

            My personal view on this -Hecklers – assholes.Tiger JK – hypocritical asshole.

        • GaCaRa

          I highly recommend you look through that link in the end of the article. You will learn that there is no such thing as reverse racism

          • Mike Newcomb

            Umm, because it is on the internet it is true?  Adjusting your behaviors, thoughts, or actions towards an individual or group based solely on their race, is racism.  

            The colors of the parties involved do not matter.

      • http://www.out-of-korea.com/ Claire

         No it is implying as I understand it  that you can racialise anything. And that the author is doing that. And that once you have started this process you can never stop.

        • Mike Newcomb

          Pretty much spot on.

  • http://www.facebook.com/Juicy.Strawberry.1 Choi Reisha

    I applaud you! Great article!

  • MAR_M3anie

     Glad you wrote the article Amy.  Good job in breaking it down.

  • Bhongo

    Thanks Amy for the link for all those articles. People need to read them after reading your article.

  • kpopfan6

    I doubt that Tiger JK is actually racist, but it seems blatantly obvious that what he did at the Creator’s Project was rude, unprofessional, and in bad taste. Hence him apologizing was very called for and made much more sense then him acting like he did nothing wrong.

    Since Tiger JK’s been performing for years, I doubt that what those hecklers were the first he’s ever come across and this was the worst heckling he’s ever experienced. So I don’t see how a some heckling from a few people justifies 10+ minutes of  Tiger JK screaming and cursing out the entire audience and then him going nuts on Twitter. If the hecklers were such a problem then he could’ve called security to get rid of the them or left the stage so he could calm himself down. What JK did was unfair to the other 99% of the audience that came (and probably paid good money) to have a nice evening and ended up shocked, confused or even hurt by what Tiger JK said.  

    I do think Tiger JK is definitely a good person at heart, but his actions were careless and were clouded by anger. Although this whole incident sort of became a way to bring up a more important discussion, this was really not a good way to do it… AT ALL.There’s not much use in Seoulbeats trying to justify anything because you can’t make a 100% legit case to defend what happened. Even Tiger JK seems to already know this, so what does that tell you?

  • http://twitter.com/superwoman5060 Hannah

    He responded to racism with racism. Is it understandable? Sure. But it sure as hell aint pretty.

  • http://twitter.com/aetnelata Marika

    A very well thought out article. I was baffled to see Tiger JK apologizing and I was hoping that kpop fans would take a few minutes to see why this happened. He has been a vocal and active proponent of social commentary in the Korean entertainment industry and his awareness of his generalization but continued adherence to his original frustration is something I respect about him. People here will yell at each other until they are blue in the face because they don’t WANT to see the structures that racism has put into place for Asian people in the Western entertainment world. The stereotypes and roles that non-kpop audiences are defaulting to with people like Psy are generations old, and in this “post racial” world where people claim to be “colorblind” this treatment is excused. Our world, particularly in the West, is NOT post racial or post colonial. People who are not white or do not speak English are immediately categorized and stereotyped, and if people do not continue to listen to those who bring awareness to their experiences of it then they will continue to perpetuate the same racist structures they were brought up in. 

  • http://twitter.com/A7316A AB

    I believe Tiger JK should have apologized but only for the unprofessional behavior he displayed at an event for which he was the South Korean representative. I find it reasonable to ask hecklers to stop, but the curses didn’t have to be there.

    On the subject of racism, there was not anything racist about what Tiger JK said. Did he generalize? Yes. But is that the same thing as participating in racism? No. While it seems unfair that the white population is unable to lay claim to being victims of racism, it’s something that is inherent within the social structures of society. The definition of racism as prejudice with power is a sociological one. Though there have been measures taken to equalize all races or ethnicities with one another, they have not been fully successful. We’d all like to wear a pair of rose-colored glasses and say that race doesn’t matter or that we’re above that, but we (by this I’m referring to the United States as that’s my only point of reference) still have instances of the race with greater power–the white population–using that power to insult or discriminate against other ethnicities. I’m not usually ever referred to as just a girl or a young girl. It’s always the Indian girl. Or the Asian girl. I’ve grown up in a society where when I look in the mirror, I see brown skin first no matter how many times I look. I’m proud of the culture I’ve come from, but everything I’ve watched, seen, or read as I’ve grown up has been in comparison to the white population. 

    Claims can be made that within the music industry specifically there is greater variation of cultures represented, in particular African-American ones, but you cannot say that there is a large Asian influence. African-Americans have ingrained themselves particularly within the music industry, but still are lacking in power in other industries. But to get back to the focus of this article, Tiger JK was performing in Seoul. In South Korea. To be encouraged in his own country to perform a dance that is not his speaks of disgusting ignorance and stereotypes. That was probably the last place he expected to encounter such jibes, so really, it’s no surprise he acted the way he did. And having the performance in South Korea doesn’t mean Tiger JK receives a magical boost of social power. From even just looking at the K-pop scene, the goal is always to expand across the world, to make it to the United States. Even in South Korea, for part of the music scene, the American has greater power at his or her disposal than a South Korean, no matter their prominence.

  • eve92

     I actually thought long about posting anything on the issue because I feel that i haven’t really come into contact with any kind of racism up close and so I am reluctant to speak my opinion. I do not know what it is like to be looked down upon because of your race, but I do know what it’s like to be punished for the sins of your grandparents and I think that is the actual issue I have with this article.

    The whole term ‘white people’ makes me mad as hell, because it lumps me together with the sort of people on Tiger JK’s concert who showed so little consideration for an other culture. I’m going out of my way trying to understand other cultures, but all my efforts are disregared, because a few douchebags, who share my skincolour, have no sense of respect and understanding. No, I don’t have any hurt feelings about the insults towards my genetic race, but yes, I feel offended by the fact that I’m being judged by other peoples sins just because we share skin and bonestructure.

    I do not judge Tiger JK’s rant, but I do judge the statement that his apology should not have taken place. I think he did the right thing by apologizing, because a) hatred always generates hatred and the great man is the one who stands above it, b) he felt the need to apologize and c) he did disregard with his comment all the ‘white’ people who are making an effort to fight aganist racism and are openminded and respectful towards people of all races.

    I mean, at the end of the day, fighting racism is about breaching gapes and the distinction of ‘them’ and ‘us’, because (man I cannot believe I’m going to say something so sappy) we are part of one and the same race, the human race and every other distinction is man-made.

    • destinyanglin

      “The whole term ‘white people’ makes me mad as hell, because it lumps me together with the sort of people on Tiger JK’s concert who showed so little consideration for an other culture. I’m going out of my way trying to understand other cultures, but all my efforts are disregared, because a few douchebags, who share my skincolour, have no sense of respect and understanding”

      Pretty much how Tiger and every other person apart of the “minority” feels.

      • peachstem

        What’s your point though? So you are agreeing with the OP that white people experience racism as well as minorities? And therefore Tiger’s rant was hypocritical?

        Or are you trying to divert the attention to how minorities are always victimized and that whatever they do, it’s justified because white people are always more powerful than them?

  • wickfan

     I have a serious question will someone explain to me the Holocaust (7 million death toll that included Jews predominated, homosexual, Gypsy and more) or the Irish slavery that occur in the British Isles because I truly believe that was a form of racism. I truly feel racism can occur to white people as well.
    I do not believe Tiger jk was racist but he basically judge and went on a rampage of hate towarrds hecklers. I am surprise he used twitter for this and I am pretty sure he apologize because he realize how unprofessional it was for him to go on a rampage.

    • http://twitter.com/littlegirlgray6 Rosa

      Although I am no expert, I don’t necessarily think that we can clearly use the Holocaust and the harsh colonial experience of the Irish as examples of “white racism.” I think that it has to be defined in a different way, to give it a more accurate definition.

      For starters, I believe that the Jews and the Irish were both “racialized” by both the Germans and the British respectively, as inferior, uncivilized and inferior. While the British had more of a colonial, “white man’s burden” mentality, both situations can be classed as white supremacy and the two cases being a product of the system of superiority of a certain type of whiteness. Although being “white” themselves, both the British and Germans did not see as being like them, the right kind of white, which basically pertains to being the more privileged, and empowered “race.” The Irish, although experienced differently, can be equated with the colonial strife in Africa and Asia, and the Jews with other experiences with genocide. In saying that, almost each of these situations were created out of the division of peoples based on colour and ethnicity were created out of one group feeling more dominant over a lesser race.

      This is why I, like Audre Lorde, prefer the usage of the term “white supremacy” over “racism” because I believe that clearly shows the root of the issue and can, in a way, affect all races, depending on the situation. We live in a world where everyone must pertain to a certain ideal, being the ideal ‘white’, and those who aren’t white enough, are considered inferior. I am also not sold on the whole idea of ‘race’, and prefer using ‘colourism’ instead for the same reason.

    • LimpyLimpious

      Basically, when people want to do a horrible thing to someone else, they need an ideology, a set of ideas, to make the rest follow them. So they use old prejudices or create the new ones and spread the idea, like racist prejudices, through propaganda or other means, to convince other people that certain groups are inherently evil or stuff like that.

      So, ideas like racism serves like an excuse to dehumanize and push certain groups of people to the bottom of society, so that the privileged ones could have an exclusive access to certain resources, like becoming rich.

      Before the World War II Germany was in a state of poverty, being a loser of WW I and a victim of Great Depression, so they elected Hitler who promised fast prosperity by attacking other countries and their wealth. To convince his people to kill other people, he put all the blame for poverty on Jews cause they presumably held the most of wealth and didn’t want to share, and they weren’t people after all, according to old European prejudices, cause they killed Jesus. Story goes smth like that.

      And UK wanted power over Irish lands, so they convinced their people that Irish were filthy catholics and English were protestant so they were better than them. And the wars and all were ready to go. But English have a lot of bad history with Irish for centuries.

      Racism servers as a mechanism to justify the right of powerful people’s greed for money and power, and convince the other same as them to get to it together.

      And that thing with Irish would be better called xenophobia, and with Jews, IDK. Different sources tell a different thing: its either a religion, a nationality or a race, or all three.

      And racism is a bigger problem in US, cause they categorized as different races but they are all one big nation of Americans. IDK for the rest of the world. In Europe, they tend to discriminate more by ethnicity and religion, cause we’re all white, or used to be before this whole immigration thing.

  • http://www.facebook.com/Yaminomomo Daesha O’Leary

    I really agree with this article, except for the part about reverse racism not existing. I believe it does exist, but it’s just simple old racism towards a majority. We may not hear about it as much, but I think it’s there. To define it as you did is dangerous and could excuse actions that could harm others.

    I am biracial and have experienced racial slurs from both sides of the fence. My white friends like to say things (jokingly) like “How are you eating your own food? You’re black, you shouldn’t be able to afford that on your family welfare”, while my black friends like to call me things like “cracker” or “Wigga”. This stuff isn’t bad enough for me to react negatively towards them, but it does frustrate me to no end. From another perspective, I have also lived in Korea for a time and while going out I would be told things like “Make sure you don’t get too rowdy”, like my Korean friends wanted to ensure that I wouldn’t cause trouble for them like the crazy westerner I was. And back home, a lot of my Korean friends were subject to “Pffft, stop tryna dance and go do some math”.

    So yeah, I think racism appears in all forms and hurts no matter what the race of the person who is saying or hearing those things. As far as I’m concerned, race shouldn’t matter at all. A race does not define a person in any way. If someone is being a jerk to someone because of the recipients race, they’re being racist, end of story. But yeah, that’s just my opinion. ^^

  • LimpyLimpious

    I kinda understand Tiger JK and all the pent-up frustration he has, cause the thing is that, racial stereotypes follow people of non-white race EVERYWHERE. It doesn’t matter if that individual is rich, poor, a president, or has done everything in his life to be different from stereotypes typical for his or hers racial group. And being boxed-up in a certain stereotype feels dehumanizing, as the minority around always labels you with certain non-existing traits that makes you unequal to them even though you feel yourself as a human, like the rest. Better said, people tend to believe that certain traits is what people of non-white races are born with.

    And it seems, even to extent that people talk rather about JK’s rude behaviour than the wrong behaviour of the white people in the audience who wanted him to do the horse dance, cause he’s Asian. I wouldn’t be so harsh to call on the those white people as racist, but they acted aware or unaware like that because of certain stereotypes they picked up trough growing up. 

    So, I think that people need to understand JK’s reaction. Though, IMO people nowdays avoid any discussion about racism or ignore it, so only such “rude” behaviour of JK can trigger the talking about an issue that is still very much present. Though, again, that comes from my personal experience when talking with people I know from US.

    IMO, in America, the biggest export of pop culture and racial stereotypes, it seems to me that racism is still present and that stuff is so complicated. I recently watched a NG documentary about some prison in Detroit, and most of the inmates were black people, locked up for things such as prostution, drug possession, and drug dealing. And most of them had one thing in common – they were poor. They came from poor neighbourhoods with high crime-rates and unemployment and insecurity and countless other stupidities, and their crimes were actually the only way to make a living, than they did cause they were evil, or had behaviour problems that have to be punished, like the judge always told them.

    Aside from the fact that America wants to solve crime problems with constantly locking up people for easy crimes that in many countries are decriminalized, instead of you know, providing some kind of opportunity to get out of this kind of living, and that white people get milder punishments for same crimes… racism serves as an instrument to get non-white races to live in poverty so that white people could have all the access to all the resources, and to prevent poor white people to unite with them to fight for the right for decent living everybody deserves.

    So, the bottom line is that, it’s sad that only this kind of JK’s acts open up discussion about racial issues,cause sometimes it seems that everybody thinks that it’s better to be ignorant and hope that the problems would go away by wishful thinking. And I hope that Psy’s success improves the life of Asians, so that they could be percieved as something more than people to steal our jobs, or that they are nerds and bad drivers, and similar you-know-what.

    And sorry for my wall of test and spelling mistakes. I really do understand all the frustrations Psy has with English. It really is a difficult language.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_2UNQGN7IPNTIRIWBNVHEFBHHV4 a z

      Man, i LOVE your comment. Where are you from may i ask? 

      Your insight on the documentary about the prison in Detroit really touched me because many people Americans especially) don’t understand why black people struggle the way they do in America, and why even if they try many cannot escape falling into situations that lead up to imprisonment.
      Also your english is better than a big majority of Americans who grow up only reading and writing in english :)

      • LimpyLimpious

        I’m from Central Europe, from country where like 100% of people are Catholic and white, including me. So, I can’t really know from personal experience how it is being targeted with racism, and probably never do.
        Yet, my personal view is that locking up people away constantly for small crimes isn’t  going to solve anything, because there’s still underlying issue of poverty. Decriminalizing small crimes such as drug posession, prostitution (at least for the prostitutes), drug dealing on small scales (cause these crimes are almost always done from people without access to other income), providing safe schools, fighting unemployment and an wide-spread education on racial issues and systematic oppression is the only way. Because when trapped in that vicious circle of poverty without no way out is hell.
        And you don’t have to be a smartass to figure out that whole thing in America favors white people. Or I may have overeacted to base my opinion on a documentary and the things I’ve read, I hope. But who am I to talk,

  • http://www.michelle-chin.com/ Michelle Chin

    I feel that there is no need for him to apologize, really. I mean, if it is done out of courtesy, I understand that but I think his statement, no matter how others perceive as racist, is dead true and rings a bell that everybody denies listening. I mean, which pop star will admit that they liked PSY’s Gangnam Style because he fits that gag role, which are normally reserved for Asian men who are often depicted as lacking masculinity? 

    With Gangnam Style, I was initially quite happy about it being popular. I mean, finally, K-pop travelling to the suburbs in the States! You know, so many Korean pop stars try to achieve that but their efforts end up futile, and along came PSY, and Bam! This happened. Everyone’s talking about, everyone’s listening to it, and there’s two flash mobs where I am staying now. I’m not Korean but the thing is, I share the pride that most of my Korean friends have. 

    However, unlike some of my Korean friends, who are not quite aware of the insidious racism that comes along with PSY’s popularity in Western countries, I feel a bit disturbed by this thought that PSY, instead of being appreciated for making such an addicted music, is turning into an Asian joke amongst Westerners. I have to admit, it irates me a little. And the thing is, now it seems that there is this expectation that Asians to be able to do the horse dance!! What a weird way stereotype can mould itself to be! In a form of a dance!

  • theonetwo

    i cant really agree with what tiger jk did.  you dont fight racism with more racism.  he should know this especially since his family is biracial and they themselves have gone through racism.  the guy was angry because of the hecklers and i get that but to generalize an entire race because of it?  come on,  it could have been dealt with more professionally.  instead, he stooped to the level of those racists who called his wife and son derogatory names.

    who is he?  kramer from seinfeld?

    also,  this whole notion that reverse racism doesn’t exist is laughable.  racism is racism period.  people want to bring up lack of power as an excuse of not being racist.  fine, where was this event held at again?  who is the majority in that country again?  is tiger jk not a public figure who can get peoples attention?  there, im pretty sure this is the power that the author is talking about.

    sad but tiger jk comes out of this looking like a huge hypocrite.

  • http://twitter.com/catEYEx3 Clairi

    Amen. To everything. :D

  • hanje

    wow at all the derailing going on in some of these comments. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Kristina-Nisi/512211259 Kristina Nisi

    I enjoyed and agreed with most of this artice; what the author was referring to for the hecklers and so on, is called the anchoring effect. We can clearly see it especially now with the popularity of Psy’s ‘Gangnam Style’. Because of the huge worldly popularity of Psy’s song at the moment, if the white concert goers had not really been into K-pop before, ‘Gangnam Style’ would have surely introduced them to it. With the anchoring effect, we generalize our feelings and ideas about something, in this situation korean music, and we expect every other asian entertainer/singer/etc. to be exactly like that first introduction. As humans we do it all the time, regardless of race, class, religion, age, or sex. It does not discriminate, which is what the white concert goers did. However, the point that was made that reverse racism doesn’t exist is not true, since racism itself isn’t defined by specific groups versus other groups; it’s merely an ideology that people hold that a race is innately superior or inferior because of characteristic traits, abilities, qualities, personality traits, intellect, morality and other cultural behavioural characteristics that are inherited.
    I can understand Tiger JK’s annoyance and anger towards the concert goers as they represent some of the most narrow-minded foreigners who do not represent the whole. And I am somewhat angered that he felt the need to apologize for telling them basically “I’m not Psy, that’s not MY song, therefore you can either shut up during my set, or you can leave.”. I get a horrible feeling when any korean musical artist/singer/etc. has to apologize for certain actions/behaviours, simply because they were defending themselves/families/beliefs, etc. Are they supposed to just take it? Allow people (regardless of sex,age,race) to discriminate or be prejudiced towards them? And yet we have so many specific groups up in arms when they are the ones being discriminated against or having stereotypes thrust on them. What makes it not okay for Tiger JK to stand up and say, I will not stand still, I will not stand silent; I am a person who deserves respect, kindness, and understanding. I should not be punished for speaking out against discrimination and prejudice. I should be applauded.
    I would have done the same thing, said around the same thing, because he is not their prop, and they are not his master.
    Also, while I do agree with the Chelsea Handler bit, I do feel the need to point out that she does stuff like that with/to everyone that comes on her show.

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

      “Merely an ideology that people hold that a race is innately superior or inferior” 
      Actually if your a minority who grow up in America, you probably have a idea of yourself as a minority as less than/inferior to white people even if your race is stereotyped to be the smartest race like Asians  or the best race at sports like blacks, because the media and the society that we live us convinces us we are not the norm, not even real American at times. Look up the doll test and tell me that people of every race innately find themselves more superior. We live in world that tells us the white is right, white is the norm. That is white privilege  that is racism. And it took me a long time to except my blackness, and that was only until I realized there was problem and that what I was feeling was not normal. Black people wanting to straightening their hair because braids or an Afro is seen as unprofessional or weird, Asians thinking their something wrong with their eyes,  seeing people in the media that looks nothing like you all the time, the majority of  characters who are the main character in films and movies, who are the heroes,  the pretty girls are the white people; and minorities are often times the funny one, or the one with ghetto attitude, the best friend of the white character, the background people, these are the roles we often get and just accepting that that is norm is a result of white privilege .  Racism towards whites happens but it not the same as racism towards minorities simply because we live in society that favors white skin. You may experience name calling, or even violence which is unacceptable. Im not trying to justify that and this should not be tolerated but you do not experience the type of racism that is part of a system where you are the “other”.  When I started to realize this is when I started to accept myself as black person because before I didn’t even realize that I was just accepting a racist system. People in America have no idea the concept of what racism actually is, and often times the real problems that need to be addressed get ignored unless its violence because violence is something you just can ignore, but racism is much more than name calling in violence, those things are just not acceptable, but the fact that white people hold the majority of office in America, the discrimination that minorities still face here, and the medias portrays people of color is a much bigger problem that is part of a system. Also racism that happens to white people are usually an individual experience, however minority racism affects us as a group here in America. I’m sorry but you just can’t act like prejudice and racism are the same because they are not. 

      • destinyanglin

        A++++++

        Beautiful Responce.

  • severely

    Yes, a lot of people don’t know the exact definition of racism, but the point his critics are trying to make is that he was being discriminatory and prejudiced in his tirade. You’re ignoring that point to say specifically that he wasn’t racist because he doesn’t have power. This incident took place in Seoul. In Seoul, Koreans have power, not Caucasians. He has every ability to be racist in Seoul.

    I just didn’t like that part of your argument, because you’re arguing semantics, instead of addressing the core issue of accusation.

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

      You are correct in a sense that yes, he has power in Seoul Korea. However, the US media is a very powerful tool that affects people around the world, who has power over the US media? White people, which is why this situation happened. I don’t think the author meant to ignore the situation of Tiger JK’s rude comments but is asking for people to look at the bigger picture here. 

      • theonetwo

        no, this situation happened because there were dumb hecklers in the crowd and tiger jk couldnt control himself and went completely overboard by insulting white people.

        • https://profiles.google.com/103117115170462790174 Sabrina Eugene

          You mad? lol

          • theonetwo

            oh snap, its one of those witty remarks

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            I’m replying to you under here because for some reason I can’t reply under your last comment. Your ignoring part of what he’s saying and only focusing on the part that goes with your opinion. That’s what I mean by ignoring him. Like I said his rant was part of a bigger issue. Like I said I didn’t justify it, I said he was wrong for lumping all white people together, I’m saying however the parts that he said about Hollywood and how the general American public views Asians is correct. The top consumer of the American media are white people, that is why the majority of Hollywood roles who are the main character goes to white people, that’s why the majority of singers who are minorities usually are light skinned, that is why you don’t see that many Asian actors and singers in Hollywood because at the end of the day Hollywood is about making money, since whites are the biggest consumers of Hollywood films, shows, music etc for simply being the majority, the white race is who is catered too because they bring in the most money. This not lumping all white people together, but its shows that they are excepting of these images since they continue to present themselves in our media. The majority of white people did not agree with these images they would not be there because Hollywood would make not money off of it. I’m kinda tired of repeating myself since I don’t think you will ever see my point. His comment has validity for the fact that white people was not all he said, his comment was more about Asian racism. If you chose to write off his entire comment because he got angry its because your refusing to look at the bigger picture. Hypothetically speaking- If I was a bad dancer and someone tells me I’m a bad dancer in rudest way ever, that person should be corrected for being rude, however he had a valid point in saying that I was a bad dancer none-the-less and should probably handled it better and showed me ways to improve my dancing. There is a certain way to handle any situation, and I agree he was wrong and how he handled it but like I said a thousand times, he also had a point. 

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

          Your not really getting what I’m saying. Yes that was the problem, But what those people in the audience were saying is part of a bigger problem. The situation happened because of the way people think Asians should act based of what the media tells us and a persons inability to see minorities as individual people.The way you are looking at it is simplistic. At the surface its that, but there is a bigger problem. 

          Tiger JK should have handled the situation better but come on now, you can’t ignore that their was bigger problem here. The hecklers had very stereotypical view of how he should act because he was Asian, I think a lot people in America might come to expect that of Asians singers as well if they try to cross over. 

          • theonetwo

            no, i get what youre saying. its just that youre blowing it way out of proportion.  you want to blame the US media when its just the hecklers and tiger jk who should get the backlash. 

            dont go generalizing a group of people whether its white people or americans to get your point across because people, believe it or not, arent robots.  they have brains to think for themselves.  not everyone thinks the US media is 100 percent truth. 

            also, leave the US and go to another country whos majority isnt white.  i wonder who the media caters to then?  hmmmm … im still waiting to see that kpop idol group with whites and blacks in it to debut.

            anyways, as an advocate of racism, tiger jk’s whole rant about whites and how they look at asians is especially funny since hes doing the same thing himself by thinking all white people are the same way.

            in his own words, hes a hypocrite.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            I’m blaming the US media for hecklers mind set. I am not blowing things out of proportion, you just refuse to understand another persons view point. Do you think this is the first time he’s been stereotyped? This kind of stuff happens on a daily basis to POC we know its not just a result of few people being ignorant. Let me ask you this, if it was black, white, or Hispanic rapper do you think those hecklers would have asked him to do Gangnam style? If not, then yes its a result of a bigger issue. 

            Where did I say people are robots? The media is a powerful tool, its the reason why black people are treated the way they are in places like Korea because they treat us the way they see us in the US media, even in the good ol “post racial” USA people have that mindset about black people, sometimes they don’t even realize it because its so accepted, like for example saying that some speaks “ghetto”. I think there are many different US accents why is Ebonics thought of as ghetto, because its accepted as such. The media is also the main reason why white people are treated better in Korea and other countries compared with POC because the representation of POC in the media is not good. That’s a problem, Its not blowing things out of portion, because people react to others based on stereotypes, not just these hecklers, and I’m sure they are not the only ones who probably think Asians should be and act a certain way as entertainers.The media effects pretty much everyone that has consumed it not because we are robots but because of something called conditioning.    

            If I look at another countries media, white people are still usually favored over other minorities, maybe not the majority but they aren’t stereotyped and are usually picked as the person to represent the “foreigner”, because whites have a good reputation compared with other races even outside the US. The US media is the most powerful and most influential media in the world, can we stop pretending like that has no affect because that’s the exact problem I have with addressing racism, people not willing to see another persons point and often times dismisses any real discussion concerning the issue because they can’t personally see the affects of it themselves. Like I said its not just about name-calling and violence, its part of a corrupt system.  Korea and other countries media is not shown all over the world like the US, it has little affect on others besides maybe their own people. But even then, their media is affected by our media. People are totally dismissing the real problem here. Yes he should not have said f white people, but he is right about Hollywood and the misconceptions people have about Asians in America and to totally dismiss what he was saying is wrong and derailing at best. Also just because Korea has racism or any other country for that matter, doesn’t mean  we can dismiss America’s issue. 

            Of course not everyone thinks the media is 100% true, I’m American and I don’t obviously and I’m sure many others speak against the images in America media but like I said its more a matter of conditioning and the reason why these racial stereotypes keep popping up in the American media is because it sells. If it sells well then than what does that say about us as a country. That we are accepting of these images, and that we find them entertaining. Hollywood only gives people what they want, since the majority of the people in America are white, minorities are often times given stereotypical minor roles. No one can sit here and read this and tell me they haven’t stereotyped a person before, even if its not specifically about race. Even if you think cheerleaders are stupid and mean, or people who are smart people are nerds. We all do it, not because its inborn but because we are conditioned. I’m not saying that all white people all racist, but all white people benefit from a racist system, its not their fault, but its reality. If we spent more time addressing these issues to make are society more beneficial for everyone instead of assuming that someone is generalizing all white people or Hollywood then maybe we could get some where. Since I wasn’t even stereotyping all white people. If someone told me they experience racism from the black community I am not going to assume they are talking about me because they are clearly talking about the people who were racist to them, not me. If they say f all black people or they hate black people because of racism they’ve faced from the black community then that’s another story. Again I am not saying Tiger JK is right, I’m saying he had a good point.

          • theonetwo

            look, go back up to the article and read what tiger jk said about the issue himself.

            during his rant his words were racist towards white people.  he said this himself.  that was his intent during his 10 minute tirade.  he apologized but that doesnt excuse his unprofessional behavior.  you want to deny racism even when it came from tiger jk himself then fine.  thats your choice.  ill take the man at his word.

            you want to take it to a world level then be my guest.  im just commenting on this issue.  tiger jk said himself that his words were racist towards white people and he is a hypocrite for saying the things he said during the event.

            again, im repeating only what tiger jk said.  his his words were racist towards white people and he is a hypocrite.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            Again the Issue of Tiger JK itself is a result of something much bigger though, its not a whole other level, what was said was just on the surface. I read the article. I know what he said about himself being a hypocrite   But again some of his points were valid in way that Asians are seen when he was going on that rant. Notice he only apologized for calling out all white people, he didn’t apologize for what he said about not dancing for you because he’s Asian, so again he wants people to realize that they should not stereotype Asians. So why is this point being completely ignored? Did you read my comment all the way through because I could have sworn I said him saying f white people and way he chose to handle it was not right so how am I dismissing racism towards whites again? I’m asking people to hear him out. Not just what they want to hear. Obviously you just do not want to address the rest of what he said. 

          • theonetwo

            youre clearly not getting it.  i know all about how SOME white people are.  i didnt choose to ignore it. i just didnt go generalizing all white people like tiger jk did because not everyone whos white thinks that way about asians.  not every white person thinks asians are comic relief.

            tiger wants people to stop stereotyping asians yet he goes and stereotypes all white people in the process?

            do you not see the contradiction there?  his words had racist intent towards those who are white and hes a hypocrite.  this is from tiger jk himself.  obviously you want to give him a pass and thats fine.  its your choice.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            Again how am I giving him a pass if I said I agreed that he handle the situation badly? I get it, he was being hypocritical. I could have sworn I have told you over and over I don’t agree with that. But I’m saying your ignoring what Tiger JK said and making it just about white people. This is not about just white people its actually moreso about racism against Asians. But to you its just about Tiger JK loosing his cool and the hecklers, I’m saying is about more than that.  But you keep saying I’m overreacting because you don’t get my point. I get it, I just have a different perspective from you so you can stop with your condescending attitude. You seem to have a real problem with understanding the way other people see things, which has lead you to not really understand fully the point I am making, so lets just agree to disagree. 

          • theonetwo

            im ignoring what tiger jk said?  ive been quoting tiger jk the entire time.  youre the one ignoring what hes saying and going about how his comments are valid when hes doing exactly the opposite of what he stand for.

            hes a huge advocate against racism yet he goes on a tirade about white people.  what about this point dont you understand?  how is this not about white people?

            how can his comment have any validity to it when he commits the same act?  how do you justify that?  he admits his comment was racist towards white people.  that was his intent.  you say im ignoring what tiger jk is saying but its really you who is ignoring his words.

            not all white people are racists who think asians are comic relief.  did the hecklers represent 100 percent of the white population? no.

            you keep on saying i dont understand your point.  i do. i just dont go around putting all the blame on all white people.

            whether you agree with me was never the issue.  i was just giving my opinion.

          • Waetoria

            Thank you for pointing out such an important truth! “The media is a powerful tool, its the reason why black people are treated the way they are in places like Korea because they treat us the way they see us in the US media.” I think it’s more than just the portrayals in US media but I agree that this is not cool. Going through Korea as a black person and as a white person is like night and day.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            Yeah I think its more than just the US portrayals as well, I wrote a post about this on seoulbeats before under the article “Korea’s racism- Homemade or Imported” – http://seoulbeats.com/2012/05/korean-racism-homemade-or-imported/ But I
             think its plays a heavy role. Although this is not about black people I was just using us as an example of how powerful our media is. I just wish people would look at all side concerning this, not just one. Yes, Tiger JK should not have said f white people, but come on, some of the stuff he said was spot on. When topics of blackface, and black racism comes up we are always ask to look at things through a korean’s perspective as well, and every excuse possible comes out about how we shouldn’t be offended but it seems like that has gone out the door in this thread. People are unwilling to see his point, unwilling to listen to anything else the man said. Now I am not asking people to not be offended, I’m asking them see Tiger JK’s perspective. 

          • Waetoria

            Oh I didn’t know that people asked others to look at things from a Korean perspective regarding their use of blackface. I think they have a right to say whatever they want and perform whatever funny skit they want, however tasteless it may be. It just surprises me that as a nation so obsessed over its own image, Korea doesn’t pay more attention to what is PC with respect to racial portrayals. Koreans look ignorant, mean and lacking judgment by putting such things on the air.

  • lolwtf

    Damn, white folk need to come collect their people. Just because you want “reverse racism” to be a thing doesn’t mean you get your way. I want lots of things too – like for white people to have Less Opinions, but clearly that isn’t going to happen anytime soon.

    • theonetwo

      so i guess you can agree that koreans need to come collect their people here (psy for example) since the entire system is so horrible and makes the world such a bad bad place right?

    • peachstem

      Haha wow the double standard here is incredible.

  • http://twitter.com/blossom423 Elizabeth Dong

    absolutely everything with this article Amy:)

  • destinyanglin

    Tiger’s after responce to the situation was perfect. He apologized for being
    unproffesional and generalizing white people but he does not apologize for why
    he said it and where those feelings came from and honestly that is all we can ask
    from him.

    I see alot of comments on here about race and racism. I am in agreeance with
    those who say no matter what your race you can be a person who succumbs to racist
    feelings and remarks. I do, however still agree with the author when they say
    reverse racism (in regards to those of the caucasian race – with the way our
    society is structured) does not exist.

    Racism or being racist is believing that you are better, more entitled and
    superior to another person because of your race. With this basic textbook
    definition anyone can be considered racist (it also means Tiger was not being
    racist). It gets dicey when you have a group of people set by society as being
    better, more entitled and superior. It gets hard to pin someone as racist against
    those in this group because even if a person was to have these feelings/remarks
    of being better, more entitled and superior to them society has already said a
    big “nu-uh!” therefore making the usual negative social and emotional effects of
    this particular racism moot.

    • RC_RC

      What do you mean with ‘our society’? America or South Korea?

      • destinyanglin

        Both. And not just there but many other places. If you get an attractive Korean person and an attractive caucasian person and showed them to some Korean people to choose who was prettier, the majority would choose the white person. They both are attractive, what about the one person made her prettier? Why would her being white give her that little one up on the asian girl? Of course this leaves room for an argument about the generalization of a whole nations beauty standards and ‘beauty being in the eye of the beholder’ but you can’t deny that much of that scenario would be true.

        • peachstem

          “If you get an attractive Korean person and an attractive caucasian person and showed them to some Korean people to choose who was prettier, the majority would choose the white person.”

          You have actual proof and evidence of this claim? Or are you just making things up? I’d like a link or credible source please.

          If Korean people think white people are prettier, why are white women reserved for “slutty” or sexually promicuous roles (both in modeling, MVs, movies, etc.) and Korean women are upheld as the “ideal beauties” of Korea that are worthy of being treated as queens or marriageable material? While both may be considered beautiful, you cannot say that pretty white people have a one-up over pretty Korean people.

          The popularity of Korean male idols or actors versus white male celebrities from America is really no contest. I don’t see a lot of girls or women going crazy when foreign artists come to promote in Korea, vs. when a Korean singer or group has a comeback.

          In We Got Married, Yoon Se Ah told her husband that he looks like a “blood type B” and said it’s because he looks like a “bad boy” (he’s actually A, if you’re curious, but that doesn’t matter much). Julien who is a half-Korean and half-white actor raised in Canada, dresses and acts like nothing close to a bad boy. The only differences that I can see compared to maybe a lot of other Korean actors and idols in the industry is that he is extremely tall, tall enough to be noticed from the majority, and he looks like a “white” foreigner. There’s a stigma against Caucasian people in Korean society and I don’t count that as “being more attractive” or being a preference to Korean people at all.  

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=513439726 Sharon Overlord

    Oh wow, I think I heard someone talk abt this but they were over exaggerating  They said he dissed PSY, but he didn’t. I never did believe that though, bc I just can’t see him doing that. 

    Unfortunately this article is right. I was watching Community and I’m even getting angry at these stereotypes. Why do all Indian and Asian guys need to be nerds. I find it a bit insulating that everyone there is weird and stupid except for that one white guy and girl. Seriously!? 
    What Tiger did was not the best way to handle the situation, but he was being heckled. His music is totally different from PSY’s, yet he’s expected to act and dance like him. 

  • ybkdik91

    The actual issue has been dealt with & although I don’t agree with what Tiger JK said at the concert but he has addressed the issue & has apologized, he know he did something wrong & owned up to it, doesn’t mean that those people who heckled him get off scot-free, they are a sad indication of what the Western world deem Asians to be like – comic relief.
     

  • peachstem

    I won’t tag on a moral “wrong or right” on his reaction, but I DO believe there are better ways to react than to be angry and lose your temper, if I was in his situation. Granted, I’m a different person and grew up with different experiences so keep that in mind.

    Did it hurt when my white friend in elementary school rejected me because I “wasn’t Irish”? Or when my white friends in middle school made fun of my dancing and said that I should be able to dance well because I was Asian? Or when guys in college came up to me with “yellow fever” and blatantly asking me if I really was “tighter” down there, or I kid you not, telling me that I wasn’t Asian enough because I couldn’t name all the members of SNSD? And a thousand other petty, stupid comments made by ignorant people? And a million more little nitpicks or obviously condescending attitudes about my race?

    Yeah, it is VERY tiring. I understand how Tiger JK must have felt during his performance. Maybe his tirade wasn’t “racist” but it was a blanket generalization and that was unfair of him to say. I have met many white people who are informed and open-minded. Just yelling obscenities about Hollywood, white people, etc. etc. honestly solves nothing. If he takes it upon himself to be an advocate/role model against racism, I’d like to see him set a good example for others by being mature and taking actions to fix the issue than just spouting angry words. For ex. he could have asked security to remove them if they were really being disruptive or rude – it’s a performer’s right anyway.

    “You can only handle so much until you blow up” is not really a good excuse IMO. In some conflicted areas, “blowing up” means murder or violence. He was in his “work environment” and I’d expect him to be professional in that situation, no matter how frustrated he was. I highly respect people who have patience. And as someone who has been discriminated against I DO understand how hard it is, but that is why I hold people to such high esteem if they do have it and exercise it frequently.

    I don’t get the argument people are making about reverse racism regarding whites. White people are discriminated against too, just not in America (mostly). I mean, how many articles has SB covered regarding racism toward (white) foreigners? Or the objectification of white women in Kpop MVs? Even in Hawaii with the Asian majority, I’ve read white people are given slang labels and have to deal with prejudice also. If I misunderstood the comments people are making about this topic I apologize – I’m skimming through comments pretty quickly so please correct me if I’m making an ignorant statement. I just PERSONALLY believe that in order to advocate against racism, you can’t get into this mentality of being bitter or vengeful and expecting white people to “know how it feels” before minorities can respect their opinion. That cycle of hate and antagonism doesn’t help anyone IMO. It has to stop somewhere. Yes, there are a lot of white people out there who may even take deliberate steps to oppress the non-majority, but there are just as many who support the oppressed… Just my two cents.

    • Waetoria

      I have very similar experiences as you do about petty, stupid comments by ignorant people. But I’m Korean American and I love a racist Korean joke and any other racial joke, I find it hilarious but only when coming from people who understand it’s a joke and who are open and non-racist. We all mean it in good fun and recognize that our comments are ridiculous. These people are usually not Koreans (Koreans from Korea, not Korean Americans) …

  • http://twitter.com/PhanTheHotness Jenny

    i don’t think he had to apologize at all. It was first, very rude of those white people to just yell that at him when he was performing his songs. And Tiger JK has a point. It’s ridiculous how Korean people generalize white people and look down on black people. And considering, most of the artists listen to “black people music”. I’ve always thought that was the most racist thing to happen in Korea. But, it’s not like white people don’t stereotype asian people too. It’s mostly kung-fu and squinty eyes. 

    And honestly, Psy is just a dancing prop in America. He’ll just make a dent in the music scene here. 

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/R5BKARJWK7NNOXYOIUSP76YJW4 Aj

    He did generalized and that would sound as being racist, he knew that and so kudos to him for apologizing for something he said in a fit of anger. This would probably be the first of many other after-effects of the Gangnam Style phenomenom. Every other Korean acts would be expected to be doing the same thing Psy did in the eyes of people who dont  know Kpop at all which is sad in a way.

  • http://twitter.com/theepicmaknae_ CHRISTINE : 逸菲 ♚

    Someone care to enlighten me ? (I havent made it very far through the tumblr post, its very long) If the definition of racism is “prejudice plus power” then shouldn’t tiger jk be racist? He was performing in Seoul, Korea where Koreans are the majority. Not to mention that he is a public figure.

    As often discussed on Seoulbeats, Korea is where racial prejudice and stereotyping is prevalent in society. Prejudice has incurred against minority races such as blacks, whites and races from other Asian countries. (By minority I mean minority in Korea). Therefore it would be fair to say that power has been granted in Korea, “systematically through various institutions normalized by your society — to purposefully oppress another race.” And its is logical to conclude that Korea is capable of being racist.

    Although I understand that the author is considering America as the country with biggest global influence/power, with a prevalent white society which is very racist, but the incident occured in Korea and not America. And Caucasians are minority in Korea.

    • Gaya_SB

      I think this is the link in the post that you are after (listed as: But White People Are Discriminated Against In Foreign Countries x)

      http://ethiopienne.tumblr.com/post/16926726442/tsumetaihikari-the-coffee-addict-pro-tip

      As an aside, I’d like to mention every time SMtown gets its concerts broadcast on TV, it’s almost always the white fans that are focused on (for better or for worse), followed by (East) Asian fans. You’d never realise that there even were black or brown K-pop fans in attendance.In fact, I’d actually assumed that most of the writers for this site were white until I joined the staff myself. Of course, I should have realised that there would be K-pop fans who were POC (hell, I’m a POC myself) but I didn’t: I had just automatically assumed almost everyone (besides those whose names were obviously not “white” names and Gil because she liked Yuvan Shankar Raja) was in fact white. And this is the extent of racism: where I can’t even remember that other POC exist and automatically fall into the default of self-identifying a person as white, when I should instead be waiting for confirmation and not jumping to conclusions. But I digress.The point remains that racism which favours the notion of white superiority is present in many countries where white people are not the majority, thanks to the after-effects of imperialism and the current effects of capitalism which still give this form of discrimination currency. And that means that it will still be the white K-pop fans who are filmed at concerts.

      • http://twitter.com/theepicmaknae_ CHRISTINE : 逸菲 ♚

        Thank you for replying ^^

        Wow, I would’ve thought most K-pop fans would be of Asian nature and trust me, SM is just pumping up Hallyu. In Australia, where I live I don’t usually see many Caucasian kpop fans :/ Or Indian and let alone black kpop fans. I dont even see many Africans on daily basis. But I’ve seen a lot more coloured fans from other countries.And I do not deny that ‘white superiority’ exists. A lot of racism was/is caused by this. Although I do not personally know any indigenous people of lands which were colonised by whites (as your link was mainly about colonised countries), in China (I am ethnically Chinese), the ideal beauty (big eyes with double crease, light skin and now maybe height?) would be fulfilled by that of a white person (i think its fair to say asians are genetically smaller). And many Chinese people to look up to whites and think they are racially superior. ( I don’t the beauty ideals were influenced by the Western countries though, I think it was just a matter of rarity to have large eyes, and therefore more precious and so on and so forth. And as for light skin, yeah, showed/shows how rich you are.) 

        And of course Korea is largely influenced by ‘white’ countries, predominantly by America. K-pop is closely modeled to A-pop and what else have you…fashion? et cetera. However I do not find that ‘white superiority’ =/= power (in the case of uncolonised countries) and therefore wasn’t able to justify the definition of racism provided by this article.Nevertheless, as replied by flamey, history is a justification. I find that satisfactory although I still have some qualms about the definition :/ I think your link and the tumblr post (which I have read 2 links of ^^;) does hint at this but flamey provided a clearer explanation. phew….huge chunk i wrote there =o=;-3

        • Gaya_SB

          You’re welcome :) I’m Australian too, and I can see that there are more (East) Asian K-pop fans than there are any other ethnicities, though I do have friends of various backgrounds who are aware of and are casual listeners of K-pop.

          In addition to the historical justification, there is also the matter of current-day consumerism to consider. The US wields a considerable amount of soft power over the rest of the world to the extent that everyone is familiar with US culture (just think of the amount of American content vs. local content, especially for scripted shows like drama and comedy, in Australia). This is why Tiger JK called out Hollywood in his tirade, because it does reinforce that predominantly white image, and that is what is being seen by more and more people around the world.

          As for your views on beauty ideals, it seems the same thing applies in other cultures too. They are not based on white people, but there is not denying that white people can benefit from this, whether they want to or not.

      • jessoa

         But white people are discriminated against in their own countries. Do you have anything that isn’t written by an American?

      • Waetoria

        Great point about SMTown broadcasts. This last broadcast of SMTown in Seoul featured so many shots of non-Koreans that it seemed like every foreigner, which was likely to be very few, got some camera time! It does no one any good to falsely represent the real makeup of SMTown concerts, especially in Seoul which has very few foreigners respective to other international cities. 

  • http://twitter.com/theepicmaknae_ CHRISTINE : 逸菲 ♚

    On what basis are racial groups ordered in terms of power? Global influence? GDP? HDI? I don’t understand the author’s definition of ‘power.’ Because that ordering is prejudice within itself. Somalians can be prejudiced towards Mexicans and whites. And both Mexicans and whites maybe hurt as a result. Why does power and ranking matter?

    If a group of Somalians were to say all Asians should dance Gangname Style all day long and heckled Tiger JK to do gangnam style, wouldnt tiger jk still feel harrassed? Just because caucasians hold more global influence doesnt mean that only can be racist and only they can make tiger jk feel harrassed.

    Why can’t other racial groups be racist? Is ‘racism’ a white privilege too? If it is the same cause and the same effect, I don’t see why one group can be racist while the other can’t.

    • flamey124

      Um, history, mostly. Hangovers from the colonial era. Stereotypes still being perpetuated.

      I think “racism” here is used as a term borrowed from sociologists and academic discourse, that refers to a real historical phenomenon of minorities being systemically oppressed and disenfranchised. Saying that person A is racist because he said something against person B … kind of ignores the whole historical context behind the usage of this term racism. Waters down the intensity and historical baggage the term comes with.

      No one said ‘racism’ is a white privilege… History has mostly shown it, that’s all.

      • http://twitter.com/theepicmaknae_ CHRISTINE : 逸菲 ♚

        Ahh…ok, I see now, the context clears up the definition. Thank you for your reply ^^

  • http://twitter.com/kizzi297 kelsey coop

    what he said was racist whether he was “justified” or has a birracial wife and kid- the fact that he owned up to it is what makes me quick to forgive him.
    that’s not to say that he wasn’t provoked, there are plenty of racist people, but then again, is fighting fire with fire a good idea? people always seem to think it’s alright to hate on white people cause they’re white (and I mean seriously, White people are totally the cause of all the bad things in our history) but when it’s a different “race” it’s inexcusable.
    what I think is people need to so judging people by the color of their skin and start judging each other on the content of our souls, cause from where I stand a comment like this isn’t justifiable, no matter who said it, but because Tiger’s a mature guy he manned up and addressed that.
    he’s truly a good role model for that.

  • happy_slip

    I do think that the apology from him was needed. He reacted unprofessionally and the way he addressed those hecklers were just done in bad taste. I will not say that he’s being racist, but I do think that the implications his comments had might lead there, and I believe that he knows that as well. I actually respect him for doing so because unlike some of those hecklers, Tiger JK actually knows how comments like his or those hecklers’ (who were possibly thinking that they’re not doing anything wrong because they just see the whole thing as a joke) can fuel racism in the long run. 

  • dothrakiwomanwarrior

    Awesome article, and really hits the nail on the head. People who think that he was being racist or his anger was unjustified need to do some research and have at least a basic understanding of what racism is.

  • http://twitter.com/Marlina_Koh Marlina Koh

    you know what. This whole website is too judging towards psy. Surely most of people wud think the psy phenomenon with gangnam style is because he is funny and they don’t bother to understand the lyrics. They get the beat and it’s in korean. That’s most important. Pretty soon PSY will have to release a single in english and by that time we’ll see how america/the rest of the world view him. But i am sure he will break that off and show how awesome he is. Afterall, his works and music has always been amazing, just never known. 

  • http://twitter.com/Marlina_Koh Marlina Koh

    you know what. This whole website is too judging towards psy. Surely most of people wud think the psy phenomenon with gangnam style is because he is funny and they don’t bother to understand the lyrics. They get the beat and it’s in korean. That’s most important. Pretty soon PSY will have to release a single in english and by that time we’ll see how america/the rest of the world view him. But i am sure he will break that off and show how awesome he is. Afterall, his works and music has always been amazing, just never known. 

  • Rahnuma Hassan

    I am so glad to have read this article! It totally reflects how I felt about the Tiger JK incident and provides an excellent coverage of the ugly side of Psy’s popularity in the West. Thanks so much for writing it <3

  • flamey124

    I just wonder how he was supposed to react… I mean, was he supposed to just take it and move on? From what Tiger said he was angry at the stereotypes he perceived white people to have of Asians, that they weren’t just “comic relief”.

    I don’t think he could ever have said what he said and not be called a racist and hypocrite.

    If he chose not to say what he felt at the concert and said it later instead, for example if he said something on twitter about how “whites” perceive “Asians”,  he’d still be slammed for being racist and hypocritical, wouldn’t he? Honestly people are slamming him because he said “f*** all the white people”. If he said “f***” white people”, not “all white people”, people would still say that he’s being hypocritical because he’s making a claim against white people.

    It’s just blatantly obvious that no matter what Tiger said or could have said people would still call him a racist and hypocrite for speaking up against white people. But the thing is, that was really the issue at hand – the perception of whites being superior over minorities in culture. Tiger was talking about the stereotypes people have of “white people” that afford them power in society. Was he wrong to call out “white people” then? Offensive to some, surely. Avoidable? I don’t see how. He’s really talking about the perception of “whites” being superior and minorities being inferior, something embedded deeply in institutions and culture. Aka racism.The fact is that “white people” are viewed by society and media as a group and priviledged over minorities. So this whole furore is just another measure of how people don’t want to talk about the real issue- of racial stereotypes being pervasive and hurtful, that they’d rather talk about him cussing out “white people instead”.

    For everyone saying that not all “white people” are like that and you’re hurt and white people have been stereotyped and prejudiced and blamed, definitely you are right. Using the phrase “white people” here makes me uncomfortable already. But the extent to which white people have been judged against is definitely not to the extent of systemic racism perpetuated by old colonial structures, Hollywood and the media against minorities. I’m sorry that you feel that you are judged for being a “white person” by Tiger JK, but don’t blame him, blame the system that already accords this group of “white people” power. The fact is, being born with a different skin colour affects your lifestyle especially in the USA, and unfortunately the prevailing power is still being placed with this nebulous group society has termed “the whites” based on skin colour. Why blame Tiger for speaking out against this stereotype of “whites” as dominant?

    • theonetwo

      ill answer your first question.

      he was suppose to react to the situation professionally.  he had a problem with the hecklers then take it up with just them.  ask security to remove them and get back on with the show.  there was no need to go on that tirade about all white people.  the hecklers in korea dont represent all white people like how psy’s song and behavior in the video dont represent all asians. 

      ill answer your last question with tiger jk’s own words …

      because he was being a hypocrite that night by callin out ‘all’ white people. Since he has been a strong advocate against racism.

  • dandelioness

    But the fact remains that he was discriminating against white people in this instance. Whether or not you choose to define what he did as racism is not the point, because either way he’s still shitting on an entire group of people. The fact that white people have more power should never be used as an excuse to hate on the entire group just because of who they are.

    Edit: This is meant to be a reply to Amy who claimed it wasn’t hypocritical of him to use ‘white folk’ because he was addressing white people and not other minorities

  • mangochic

    There are parts of the article I agree and there are parts of the article I disagree. While I fully understand Tiger’s frustration with his hecklers, he does need to APOLOGIZE. First of all, it was only a few people who were heckling him but it ended up with him insulting the whole audience who probably didn’t even know what was going on. Careers have ended because of this for example Michael Richards who played Cramer in Seinfeld his comedic career ended because of his racist rant on heckler which turned into a whole thing about black people, etc.
    Second of all, he should have maintained his cool and ignored them because there will always be prejudiced people. I’m from Africa and most people I meet be it American, Asian, European, etc always assume that I used to live in a hut, fight lions everyday, starving kids everywhere or am a runner who gets chased by lions on a daily basis that is why we win so many marathon races, or they are geographically challenged as they assume I know their friend in West/South Africa when I live all the way in the East. I do not loose my cool everytime I’m confronted by this stereotype (although sometimes I want to rage at them, roll my eyes, indulge them in their delusion). I just try to correct them and move on because you never know who will be your next meal-ticket, who will open doors for you, who may be sitting on a large pile of money which can be used to fund my research, etc. Whose to say there wasn’t any Western music industry representative in the audience who was there to scout talent and ended up being on the receiving end of a rant. He lost an OPPORTUNITY to sell himself here.

    “Tiger JK’s incident is symptomatic of the subtle racism that’s given rise to the “Gangnam” phenomenon in the West, and something Tiger JK was probably the first public figure in line to suffer from.suffer from.” I disagree with this statement because you assume that Gangnam Style is only popular because audience can’t handle sexy Asian guys (that’s why Rain never took off here) and can only handle people who look like Psy. I don’t disagree that some people may be laughing at Psy but that gets old pretty fast. I think you are generalising the same way you accuse people of generalizing Asians as only there for comedic purposes. I also think you should give Psy more credit instead of cheapening it to racism. The song is entertaining, uplifting song that makes you want to dance. And he has an infectious personality that sells his songs. This is why he is getting 10-15 million views everyday because if people were only laughing at him he would be getting lower numbers as they would move on.

    “But the problem with Psy’s success is getting ugly. Psy is now a figurehead for Korea, for K-pop, and Western audiences are doing what they usually do with things that don’t look or feel like the norm: they’re assigning that image of Psy onto all people who look like him.” I understand your point here but would you still feel the same way if another group like DBSK, U-KISS made it instead of Psy. Would you still have the same reservations or would you feel better since this is the similar to the current face of k-pop? What about people who don’t look like U-KISS and are musicians, would you say there is a problem as they aren’t being represented and there is a risk of having people assume every male musician is skinny and effiminate? Do you get my point? One person can’t be the main representative for a whole country. Koreans can be proud and should be proud of Psy but that doesn’t mean everyone will assume everyone in Korea looks like him or does the same thing he does.He is just one part of the whole.

    I find it interesting you cherry-picked which interviews to include while ignoring the Ryan Seacrest interview, the NBC interview, Billboard interview just so you could illustrate your point. You also fail to mention that Ellen invited him again the next week and conducted a better interview (although there is no excuse for the first one, should have introduced him better). Just because you consider the Chelsea interview racist doesn’t make it so. She includes sketches in her comedy show which are of a self-deprecating nature. If Psy had felt some kind of way about it, he could have declined as they shoot the sketches before airing the show. It was meant to be funny.But if you think she is racist then she is an equal-opportunity racist who forgets that she is white.

    Wouldn’t be awesome if one of these days, seoulbeats just might write one article on Psy that doesn’t include any shade and highlights his other songs. Or is it too much to hope for?

    • RC_RC

      “Wouldn’t be awesome if one of these days, seoulbeats just might write one article on Psy that doesn’t include any shade “….

      That is unlikely to happen. Talking about negative things or potentially negative things gets people talking. Maybe it is a bit the same with Africa?…Western journalists focus on the bad and sensational things and ignore the good and common things?

      • mangochic

        I think they also focus on the bad but they still highlight the good. If an artist from my country had a song with so many hits on youtube and went to so many interviews and performed in so many places, it would be celebrated. People would be so happy for him and you wouldn’t hear talk of he only succeeded because he fit a certain stereotype or his success is bad for the local music industry. *shrugs*

        • RC_RC

          Maybe I didn’t make myself clear, so I rewrite:

          “Wouldn’t be awesome if one of these days, seoulbeats just might write one article on Psy that doesn’t include any shade “….That is unlikely to happen. Talking about negative things or potentially negative things gets people talking. Maybe it is a bit the same with Africa?…Western journalists focus on the bad and sensational things in Africa and ignore the good and common things in Africa?

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            UH…an entire country and one man (Psy) cannot really be compared….

          • RC_RC

            Don’t understand. Which country? Africa is a continent and not a country. 

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            I meant continent. But you should understand my comment either way. You can’t compare an entire CONTINENT to one man. More clear? 

          • RC_RC

            You meant continent…

            I was just saying that journalists, bloggers…focus on the negative or potentially negative things. I can compare what people write about Africa with what people write about Psy. 

    • http://seoulbeats.com Johnelle

      Apparently you missed this article http://seoulbeats.com/2012/07/riding-round-gangnam-psy-style/ that was released when the MV initially debuted. Seriously it’s not like we never write anything positive–it’s that people are more inclined to notice and feed on the negative.

      I can’t speak for everyone, but I don’t think any of us here has anything against PSY.  He’s doing his thing and it’s what he’s always done–it’s not like he sold out and purposely made “Gangnam Style” to appeal to the international masses by belittling himself.  I’m glad for PSY, he’s paid his dues for over 10 years and now by some twist of fate he’s experiencing some major popularity.

      The problem that is talked about is how his success is being perceived by those that have no prior knowledge of K-pop or even Korean culture and how that in turn is having a negative affect on K-pop.

      • mangochic

        Sorry I missed that article, but am happy, at least one positive Psy article out of the weekly Psy’s success bringing down k-pop articles.

        I understand the problem but I I disagree with the whole notion that one person is representative of the whole country. A country is made up of so many people with unique personalities that it doesn’t make sense to lump them up and say one person has all their qualities. Normal thinking people would know that Psy isn’t the only thing Korea offers and would know that not every musician is like Psy. (I don’t include the hecklers as normal thinking individuals).

        I disagree with the implication that since Psy doesn’t look or sing or dance a certain way, the reason for his success is because he plays up to people’s stereotypes (which was implied in the article). More credit should be given to the artist, he made a song that everyone no matter what nationality can appreciate, get entertained and dance to it.

        I have asked around my friends, who don’t listen to k-pop or watch k-drama, why they like the song. They told me that it’s because its a fun song. I asked them if the video fulfilled some stereotypes they had about Asian people and they said it actually destroyed them, they always thought Asians were uptight and serious all the time but this shows that they can have fun. I know this doesn’t represent the whole GS audience but it’s just a snapshot.

        I still wonder though if we would be having this same discussion if Big Bang or Super Junior was in Psy’s place. Would the author feel the same way she does if Tiger JK was asked to perform Sorry Sorry or Fantastic baby and went off on a rant. I wonder if we would still have the discussion that they are doing k-pop a disservice because people would perceive them as being skinny, effiminate guys with questionable singing, dancing and rapping talent. Or would they be called one-hit wonders all the time. Or will they be called Korea’s true representative?

        Last but not least, I don’t think one can dictate how the audience will perceive a musician’s song, people like what they like and hate what they hate. Some songs appeal to many people like GS and others like Boys will only appeal to a specific subset (SONEs). You (as a musician or fellow listener) can’t decide what others will like in a song and what they won’t or what they will laugh at or cry over. So I don’t see how this makes a difference.

        • Waetoria

          I agree that one person does not and should not represent an entire country but whether Psy likes it or not, Koreans are the one putting him on a pedestal and treating him like a national representative. 

          “Normal thinking people would know that Psy isn’t the only thing Korea offers and would know that not every musician is like Psy.” Very true. And most of my friends don’t care where he is from, they just think he’s funny and the song is catchy. And the hecklers were rude and quite ignorant in their actions. But I’m afraid that Korean companies will do everything they can to associate themselves with and imitate Psy and that will be detrimental to the perception of the Korean music scene in the U.S.

      • Gaya_SB

        <3

  • CJux

    I figured I might as well join the heated discussion on the definition of racism

    rac•ism
    noun /ˈrāˌsizəm/

    “1. The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races
    2. Prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on such a belief”
    (Google Dictionary, WordReference)

    “1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races  determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one’s own race  is superior and has the right to rule others.
    2. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.
    3. hatred or intolerance of another race  or other races.”
    (Dictionary.com)

    “the belief that people’s qualities are influenced by their race and that the members of other races are not as good as the members of your own, or the resulting unfair treatment of members of other races”
    (Cambridge Online Dictionary)

    “1. discriminatory or abusive behavior towards members of another race
    2. the prejudice that members of one race are intrinsically superior to members of other races”
    (Kids.Net.Au dictionary)

    “1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
    2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.”
    (TheFreeDictionary by Farlex)

    If Tiger JK was racist or not, I guess it depends on the dictionary definition you prefer.

    About the definition “Power + prejudice”: I believe that was a definition presented by Pat Bidol under a 1970s American context, and popularized by Judy Katz. Not everyone agrees with this definition, but it tends to appear in American studies on racism. I don’t think I’ve ever heard that definition outside the American context, but I may be wrong. Anyway, some people disagree with the definition:

    “Why “Racism = Prejudice + Power” Is The Wrong Way to Approach the Problems of Racism” by  J F Quackenbush
    http://www.wetasphalt.com/content/why-racism-prejudice-power-wrong-way-approach-problems-racism
    Some people also think the definition is offensive to blacks because it denies them power and implicates they can never have power in any circumstances. 

    I don’t think  “Prejudice + Power” is a dictionary definition but a theory presented and defended by some American scholars. You are free to agree or disagree, but I don’t think you should’ve used it as a dogmatic definition for racism because it isn’t. I’m not American, I don’t think such limited definition applies to the different situations of racism I’ve encountered in my life, neither half of my family who was born/raised in ex-African colonies and experienced some serious shit.

    So yes, from my non-American perspective, the “Fuck all white people” phrase did come off a bit racist, and also offensive to me as a white consumer. On the other hand, he said that in a rant against white Americans who have been racist towards him, and judging his character based on one or two remarks would be taking things out of context, and I’d rather not to. 

    Overall, I definately agree with anyone who stated the obivous: as a public figure he acted unprofessionally, and apologized accordingly.

  • RC_RC

    “The definition of racism is prejudice plus power. ‘ that is a paradox. It gives some people the right to be and act hateful against people of another race because they are supposed to be not powerful. However if you have the right to be and act hateful (for whatever reason) then you are really powerful and you will become more and more powerful. 

    The opressed of today can be the opressors of tomorrow. 

    I strongly disagree with your definition of racism, it will only cause more and more hate and racism. 

    I don’t believe in some kind of artificial difference between prejudice and racism. 

    • GaCaRa

      Prejudice can be based on age, skin color, height, weight, hair color, clothing, gender and yes even race. Racism is different in that prejudice Because racism is supported by the system how society is set up to operate.

      • RC_RC

        A society is not set to operate, a society evolves, there is no big plan and societies always change. There are only temporary plans. 

        It seems that you want to construct a certain definition of racism. Do you want to construct it in such way that your prejudices can’t be labeled as racism by the victims of your prejudices? You will be very powerful when the victims of your prejudices can’t label your prejudices as racism. Do you want a lot of power? The victims of your prejudices are allowed to call you a racist when you have a lot of power and you can no longer call their prejudices racism.  

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

          What they mean by prejudice+power= racism is this, If a white people generally think black people are violent  lazy, ugly etc, its affects how we are treated by the police, it affects what jobs we can get, it affects how we are allowed to appear in public. If a black person thinks the same thing about white people, well we have no power to enforce rules that benefit black people and affect an entire race of white people. If a black person thinks a white person is violent  the majority of cops are white so most likely you are not going to get shot for no reason by a black cop, if black person thinks blacks work harder than whites, since the majority of people who hold high positions are white, it will not affect your ability to get a job, if a black person thinks blonde hair is weird like the majority of white feel about natural hair, you are not going to be force to put black/brown dye in your hair even though it can be damaging to your hair in order to fit in to what looks professional to black people. I think white people can experience racism but not in the same way. I don’t approve or dismiss racism against white people. Its not an excuse to be racist towards white people, since I would not be racist towards a white person just because we live in society that favors their skin because that is not their fault, although I will agree that sometimes people do use that an excuse to be racist towards people which I will not condone. However, that is not what most people in this thread are doing.

          • RC_RC

            I don’t understand. The majority of the police in Korea isn’t white and white people have no power to enforce rules in Korea. Look Eastern Asia is developing rapidly and that is a very good thing for humanity. Their speed of progress is very impressive. I hope however that they will not use their new powers in an abusive way towards white people and black people and that means that I’m glad that Tiger JK apologized. 

            I also don’t understand why white people can’t experience racism in the same way. If I a white person can’t get a job because of his race…well he will not be happy. The opressed of today can be the opressors of tomorrow.  What you write about has I think more to do with your grudges with internal American policies and relationships between groups in America. I think that is something for the American people to decide about, not me. I do notice however that there are big differences in wealth in America, I think it has become a class society. However it is very hard to talk about with Americans about class, a lot of them don’t understand the concept and others prefer to talk about race instead but I believe that class can cause problems in a society too. And please don’t blame all the white people on the planet for the class problems in America. 

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            Tiger JK rant was about the US media, how it shapes peoples minds around the world. That’s why I am talking about America. Oppressed of today can be the oppressors of tomorrow if they become the race that has full power in the economy they live in. But right not the oppressed of today are just that, the oppressed. But on the side note, whites can experience racism in a country were they are not dominate. Never said they couldn’t. However, this whole issue about the reason why Psy is popular, could be do to the western standpoint, and how they view Asians, specifically America. Actually since the US is powerful white people are often time treated more fairly anywhere they go compared with other minorities. In Korea white people are treated better than other minorities, even other Asians. 

          • RC_RC

            American culture and media are very powerful on this planet and so are African American artists like Beyoncé. Beyoncé profits from the power of american media. What have the American media to do with some kind of ‘whiteness’ or the white race? American media are the dominant force for promoting Usher and Beyoncé etc..and they are doing a good job because those African American artists are really popular all over the planet. 

            Once the people of race A can call the people of race B racist but people of race B can’t call the people of race A racist than the people of race A rule. After that the people of race A will have the full power. And some people on this forum here think that that is fair. 

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            A lot of black celebrities…well the image of black people in American media are usually damaging to African Americans because they usually represent what white people want to see from blacks since the media is controlled by white people. Beyonce is popular because she doesn’t look like your average black person this is not taking away from her talent. But she could pass for mixed, and you can say that for a lot of black female singers in America they usually have light skin, light eyes, or are actually mixed and on average looks nothing like the majority of black females in America. As a result, black women, specifically the darker skin ones aren’t really seen as attractive around the world. We need more dark skinned women in a media that represented us in a good way, otherwise its damaging. This has everything to do with whiteness, being closer to a white image. She also often times changes her music style to appeal to a more white audience as well. Usher is pretty good representation because he does not have a bad reputation but I feel that Black men have more opportunities in the American media compared with Black women overall. African American artist are still controlled by the media and are expected to act and appeal a certain way because they will make more money catering to the majority. It’s the reason why the majority of black rappers are expected to act the way they do about money, drugs and hoes because an non-stereotypical black rapper isn’t interesting to the general public. Just like Kpop singers, American singers do not have full control of their careers, its defiantly not as bad as the Kpop industry but its there. Also comparing 2 people that have solid careers can not take away from the overall issue, there is always going to be successful people no matter what oppression goes down. Heck, there were successful blacks even back during Jim Crow days. Your example reminds of how some people think we are in a post racial area just because we have a black president. 

          • peachstem

            What about Jennifer Hudson? She has dark skin and is not trashed like she’s “ugly” in the media. Many people recognize her as being beautiful. Yes, she lost a lot of weight recently but that really has nothing to do with her race but rather anyone who is overweight in the industry will get some flack. Jennifer was successful despite her weight in her early days before the weight loss. People also don’t hesitate to call Michelle Obama beautiful (I know she’s not a pop icon but she’s a public figure nonetheless). There were many African American artists in Haiti’s “We are the World” that would fit your PERSONAL description of being “black.” But when does that stop really? Light skinned women aren’t black enough and dark skinned women aren’t light enough?

            Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t it a little insulting to black women who aren’t dark? Like they don’t deserve to be up there or can’t be appreciated ONLY for their singing because they look “too white” or can’t possibly be up there solely for their talent, because white people or non-black people can’t appreciate “true black” beauty? Why does everything have to tie in with race? IMO in terms of pop music appeal, I think race has been an increasingly diminishing factor in terms of success.

            As far as I know, I am 100% Asian but people mistake me as half-white because I don’t look like the “typical Asian” with black hair and small eyes. It’s a bit annoying when they keep insisting I must be mixed when I’m not. Am I any less Asian because I don’t look it? I don’t think so, and it’s rather insulting to assume otherwise. With the same concept, I don’t think a lighter skinned woman is any less of a “black woman” because of her own skin color. Isn’t that already kind of buying into the stereotype that black women must be very dark, or that Asian women must have tiny eyes? If we allow black women or Asian women of any shape or size just be themselves, without tagging on this huge racial umbrella over them, then we can appreciate people on an individual basis. Beyonce is just ONE example of African American artists in the media. You don’t have to identify with HER kind of beauty if you don’t want to. Anywhere else in America has many examples of beautiful black women who are “dark.”

            I think people should just do away with identifying with a certain “look” of a particular race and just accept that if a lighter-skinned black woman identifies with black, then let her be without having to get into this whole belief that she’s somehow successful because she looks more white. Beyonce is a huge talent and I have not seen many black women – regardless of skin shade – in pop outdo her in terms of having the complete package of charisma, dancing, singing, etc. on top of being beautiful. She is super confident and a great businesswoman, and I suspect that’s why she ultimately appeals to people, not because she’s “white-looking” or something. Contrarily I’ve seen a lot of lighter skinned black women who look more “mixed” or “white” than Beyonce but haven’t gotten anywhere near her status because they don’t have the same appeal or talent.

            Also B.O.B, to my knowledge, doesn’t go around rapping about hoes and money or wears excessive bling bling or “gangsta” clothes and I think he is doing pretty well for himself without conforming to that stereotype. I think the world is a lot more complicated and diverse than the picture you are seeing, honestly. You might argue that “racism and desiring “whiter” looking people is mainstream and people like BOB or Jennifer are exceptions” but I think the truly talented have found their niche regardless of skin color and I think believing in their abilities rather than being insecure about their race contributed to their success.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            I would argue that they are exceptions because its true, they are or else you would see more people like them in the media, but we don’t. Far East Movement is successful does that mean that Asians don’t face racism in the media just because they have Far East Movement, and a few Asian actors like Jackie  Chan, Rain, and Jet Lee. Are they insecure with themselves if they question that? 

            Also I’m not insecure about race at all. So I’d appreciate if you didn’t assume that. If a gay person ask for more gay people who are non-stereotypical in the US media is he insecure about being gay and if there more gay people that had confidence we would see non-stereotypical gay people because their  lack of confidence is obviously the reason why they are not successful. Or what about a person who is handicap, if he feels like he wont get a job because people will assume he cannot perform as well as someone else does he have Handicap insecurities, or does he just see a clear problem. Or what about someone who is overweight, are they insecure about themselves because they want to see people on tv who aren’t stick then? No they are just talking about their experiences and how they feel other people treat them as such, it has nothing to do with being insecure. Or what about in Korea, light skinned Koreans with double eye lids often times has a greater chance at becoming a kpop idol than darker skinned one with monolids. Now there are exceptions like SNSD’s Yuri, Hyori, Sistar’s Hyorin and Daesung, Exo’s Kai who are dark skinned. And then their are idols who don’t have double eyelids like Sunggyu, Rain, and Taeyang but the majority presented fit a certain look. If a Korean person feels like they might be discriminated against because of how they look are they insecure, do these idols that don’t fit the look mean that the discrimination is gone because there are a few exceptions? What about Lee Michelle is she insecure about her looks if she recognizes that she will have to work harder because she not fully Korean and darker skin even though she is very talented. 

            The number of light skinned women presented in the media is far greater than that of dark skinned women that’s just a fact. In the fact that light skinned black women are a minority within the black community yet are present much more often, shows that there is discrimination, because its just about talent there would be more dark skin women simply because there are more of us, unless light skin women are just more talented overall compared with dark skin women somehow. It shouldn’t be an insult to light skinned women since I never said they shouldn’t be there at all, I’m saying their should be more dark skinned women represented, since they are rarely there at all. Light skinned women have become the representation of black women in the US media. Beyonce is very talented but she also appeals to a lot of people because of her looks, lets not pretend like that is not a factor. If I count all the black female celebrity and actors that are popular, the majority of them are light skinned. Jennifer Hudson is successful but she is not nearly as successful as people like Rihanna, Beyonce, Alicia Keys, Mariah Carey, Nick Manaj etc. Actors wise Zoe Saldana, Halle Berry. If you believe that talent has found the niche regardless of skin color its because you haven’t done your research on how Hollywood works. Hollywood is actually one of few instances where people can openly say they want someone of a specific race over another without consequences. 

          • peachstem

            Thanks for replying and adding to the discussion. I don’t have much to add except to ask you to not misunderstand or misinterpret me when I talked about racial insecurity.

            “Also I’m not insecure about race at all. So I’d appreciate if you didn’t assume that.”

            I never assumed or even said that YOU personally were insecure about race in my post, so I hope you didn’t take it the wrong way.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            Black people come in many forms, so why present one over many others 90% of the time? Also people rag on Michelle Obama’s looks all the time. There a numerous articles on it actually. There was one celebrity who actually said how does Obama wake up everyday next to Michelle. Do you really think any celebrity in Hollywood is solely appreciated for their talent alone? Nope, the majority of celebrities are where they are for both looks and talent. I think one of the few celebrities I can think of that is solely appreciated for their talent only is Adele, the rest of them have some kind of sex appeal. I’m not saying that a black person must me dark skin, or an Asian women must have tiny eyes, I’m saying that their is more than one look to a person. Why hype a beauty of a race that most of us don’t have. Most black women don’t have light skin or light eyes, but the majority of these celebrities do. I think we’ve talk about these issue before on seoulbeats. Read these articles- http://seoulbeats.com/2012/07/the-dark-side-skin-colour-and-k-pop/ and
            http://seoulbeats.com/2012/05/korean-racism-homemade-or-imported/

          • peachstem

            Thanks for the links but I read those articles already as I am a regular SB follower. I still stand by my opinion. We can agree to disagree.

          • RC_RC

            Don’t agree with that. Americans immediately switch to race when you start to talk about class. I have never been able to talk with an American about class for more than one or maybe two sentences. 

          • destinyanglin

            I keep seeing you respond with this “well in Korea” statement. When talking about minority/majority issues screw actual numbers. Most people are looking at it with a view of society. Sure, whites may not be the dominant leaders in Korea but (and you can argue all you want  to about this but you know its true) even the people who live in this mostly homogenous land are fed the lifestyles, values, and beauty standards of caucasians and told that they must emulate it to be “perfect” or on par with superiority. That right there is making the “whites” be the “majority.” Not the majority in numbers but in what everyone should live, look, and act like. This is what leads into topics like white supremacy and having minorities feeling (and often being shown) that they are the “others.” The  ones who must dance and entertatin the white man. The ones on the side not worthy of a real (individual) identity but just clumped together with everyone in their racial box.

            I’m not saying what Tiger did/said was right (because him going on a tirade against all white people was definitely wrong) but you also have to understand that the way he didn’t bother to seperate the personal (the hecklers) from the their group (white people) is something that “minorities” experience everyday and what leads to blow ups like Tiger’s. The hurt that you feel by him doing that is something experienced by POC everyday and almost everywhere. For you to just constantly argue against that just further angers people here that are treated that way because, yes, for you to be generalized solely by the color of your skin in any situation is bad, but in all honesty you (as a white person) don’t experience this type of not only ignorance but backing by a whole society for the ignorance that POC do on a daily basis.

          • RC_RC

            I never felt hurt by what Tiger did and said, I;m just glad he apologized. It is probably true that Korea looks up to America like all countries do. We live in a world that is culturally defined by America, Starbucks and McDonalds are so much more than just Starbucks and McDonalds. McDonalds is for example very popular in France.  

              However that will change, Eastern Asia is become more powerful day by day and the tables are turning. There will come a time when they no longer look up to America but define their own path.  

            What kind of path will that be? Americans should think about that because it will change the role of America on a global level. 

          • peachstem

            I’m Asian and you brought up an interesting point about Asia becoming more powerful. Of course there have been discussions about China one day surpassing the US in ten or twenty years, and I don’t see that as an impossible feat at all seeing the rate they’re going. Soon Asians may be the “powerful ones” and call the shots but that privilege will come with a responsibility as well. I can’t tell you how many times I came across top-rated YouTube comments where people brag about Asian superiority. Can you imagine how people would react if a person passed off a comment like “I tried to play the guitar like him but I realized I wasn’t Asian [replace with white].” Those are a dime a dozen, just check out Sungha Jung’s guitar videos on YT to see. If someone put white people on a pedestal like how certain people are putting Asians on a pedestal, people would be going off left and right about racism and “why do whites have to be always oh-so-superior.” What excuses an Asian person, or a black or a Latino person to say the same? How can we expect mutual respect if we don’t reciprocate what we’re asking for? You can’t have your cake and eat it too. And eventually, if these “Asian powers” ever come to dominate, white children and black children and whoever from the future will be asking themselves why their hair isn’t dark or straight enough, why their eyes aren’t shaped like how Asians have them (you may laugh at that possibility now, and it might not even come in my lifetime, but this notion of white superiority has a beginning and it can also have an ENDING as well, and start with another era of ______ superiority of another race). I wouldn’t wish that upon anybody, having experienced that as a child. ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. SOMEBODY has to be the bigger person, get over their insecurities and obstacles, and find their own success, and EVENTUALLY other people from their community will follow their path (anyone who is saying that Obama didn‘t open doors for minorities as well as for his own community isn‘t looking at the bigger picture).

            And if people insist on being racist, that’s their fault and their loss. In my eyes, sometimes it becomes rather ridiculous when people keep insisting on race, race, race being a hindrance to success, or that people became successful BECAUSE of racism. My parents who arrived in America as war refugees around the 70s (when race was obviously a much bigger deal), with literally NOTHING to their name, having to live on food stamps and sleeping under dinner tables because they didn’t have the money to buy enough beds for everyone, and STILL managed to become working white-collar professionals with decent income on nothing but incredible drive, determination and perseverance, leads me to believe that I can truly do anything in today’s society regardless of my race. My parents’ story is not unique at all – hundreds of people I personally know from the same age and background (regarding ethnicity and hardship) have fared quite well under the circumstances they were given. Maybe we are not yet in that “post racial society” but we are making steady improvement. I think especially for the younger generation, there are many, many opportunities for success if you look hard enough no matter where you come from. Oftentimes people just use race as an excuse for how their lives turned out. I am NOT saying that racial issues are eradicated and that it is not a real obstacle to many people. But there are always paths around it, and observing the success of people around me in my life has led me to that conclusion.

            Long story short: IMO just because we have been discriminated against throughout history DOESN’T give us a golden ticket to excuse the lowering of ourselves to the levels of racists and making stupid comments like “we can do and say anything and it’s still justified because we’ve been oppressed” or “you don’t understand how I feel and what I’ve been through, so you must suffer first before you can say anything about this.”

  • OhJisHo

    I am in shock over this article right now and how it propogates hatred and racism. Tiger JK may not be a racist, but his remarks certainly were and he did the right thing by apologizing.  How arrogant is it of one race to assume they are above racism just because they are not the majority in power?  I believe I am safe in assuming that in Korea the majority in power are Koreans and not the few white hecklers in attendance at this particular show, which would put the white hecklers in the minority and completely invalidates the definition of racism used in this article.  This did not happen in America and it did not happen in Hollywood, it happened in Korea.  Yes, the hecklers wanted the ‘horse dance’ and how insulting that is to Tiger JK considering that isn’t his deal in the slightest, but for him to say ‘f*** all white people’ and to get sooo angry was not appropriate.  Especially considering how vocal he is against racism and hatred.  Granted, he has dealt with far more than anyone should in regards to racism and hatred, even from his own race and now directed at his innocent child, but that does not excuse his actions, it merely gives a different perspective to them.  To say that it is racist for these hecklers to think ‘Tiger JK and Psy are interchangeable because they are both Asian’ and then go off on the powers to be in Hollywood and the media in the West for propogating wrong stereoptypes and then make them interchangeable with the every day white person and not consider that racism is irresponsible and deluded. ‘People of color have to deal with these subtle acts of racism in disgusting frequency because the action of people who happen to be there race are equalized as being the actions of entire races’.  Is that not exactly what this article is doing?  Lumping an entire race of people together becuase of the actions of a few?  Hollywood and the media’s representation of things are quite skewed and most human beings are intelligent enough to realize that and not make silly judgement calls based off of it.  Does that make it right?  Not in the least.  Korea media’s representation of African American’s and Caucasian women isn’t exactly flattering either.  BOTH of which can be considered forms of racism and sexism.
    Reverse racism does exist and this article is an example of it.  The word prejudice itself is found in the definition of racism (www.m-w.com), funnily enough the word power never factors into it. So calling racism by different names doesn’t make it go away or make it okay and it shouldn’t ease anyone’s conscious if that is what they like to call their dislike or hatred.  Hatred is hatred no matter what word is used.  Tiger JK was out of line with what he said, Chelsea Handler is just extremely obnoxious to everyone so how she even factors in as example in this particular instance is beyond me, the white hecklers were out of line and Psy is an intelligent guy.  If he doesn’t want to do something or feels he is being belittled or looked down upon, then I have enough faith in him to think that he would put a stop to it.

    • GaCaRa

      Different dictionaries have different words; some use power some don’t.

      What people need to realise is that racism is a form of discrimination but not all discrimination is racism. The reason racism and sexism are most highlighted is because these forms of discrimination are built into the system itself. And this highlighting is everyone is so eager to claim to be victims of it, because it is soooo much more important and special than just plain old “discrimination”

      And why is the expectation on Psy to point out something racist? Why can’t other people think a little before they open their mouths or do something?

      And why does Psy

      • peachstem

        Your last question is interesting because it sounds to me like it’s a blame game – who deserves to be skewered on a stick for other people to judge. 

        So if Psy shouldn’t take responsibility and leave it to this group of random “other people”, who’s going to step up? Personally I think it starts with yourself to be the stronger person and rise above that.

      • OhJisHo

        Racism, prejudice, discrimination, hate – they are different sides of the same coin as far as I, personally, am concerned.  They all come from the same root of thinking one is better than another based on ridiculous reasons i.e. lighter/darker skin, wide/slanted eyes, language/cultural differences etc. All races have fallen victim to these things at one point in time and continue to. 
        The expectation isn’t on Psy to point out something as racist.  I was merely stating that Psy is intelligent and if he feels he is fitting in some Asian mold that the American public wants to put him in, then I have enough faith in his intellect to believe that he would put a stop to it.  The expectation is on EVERYONE, regardless of race, nationality, creed, religion etc, to point out and stop all of the hatred and stupid mindsets, along with thinking before they speak. 
        Psy is the gagman in Korean media as well, he is not known for being a ‘flower boy’ or the most physically attractive person on the Kpop scene, he is known for being funny, tongue in cheek, intelligent and witty even in his own country. So to lay blame on the American/Western public for liking a phenomenal song and trying to typecast Psy in their Asian ‘box’ when that is his schtick at home as well as abroad is really silly to say the least. 

  • http://twitter.com/KristyHearts_05 Kristina

    I am so disgusted by this article. For someone who is against racism, you sure do sound like a hypocrite. Instead of being hateful and racist, you should learn to accept people regardless of their skin color or who their ancestors were! Yes, that also includes white people. I don’t get why some minorities feel they have the privilege to act racist towards white people because of the past. Today, is 2012. Yes, it’s good to not forget your past but it’s also good to learn to move on. Learn to not hold grudges on AN ENTIRE RACE! Seriously haven’t you heard? “An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.”
    Plain and simple, what TigerJK said was wrong! Sure, it wasn’t appropriate for those white people to ask him to dance and yes Asians aren’t a comedic act. But yet again, you’re completely backwards to think that white people can’t experience racism. And for the people who think white people can’t experience racism because they’re the majority…..White people aren’t the majority everywhere. Heck, the world is becoming less white as the years come and go.

    • theonetwo

      exactly … its also funny that tiger jk himself said his rant was racist toward white people and yet some of these people commenting are trying to say that it wasnt as if they knew what his intention was.

      • http://twitter.com/KristyHearts_05 Kristina

        I know right?! SMDH! I’m baffled by some of the comments on this article too. 

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

      Nobody is living the past, it is racism of today that people are discussing. Also the past directly affects the future. It’s not grudge, you can’t ignore the affects of it today, we have to work to make it better for everyone. I think its weird that people tell others to get over the past when this country has some many holidays celebrating things that happened in the past to make this country what is today lol. The past matters. Also we aren’t blaming you for anything, we are saying that you benefit from it. That is the truth. 

      • http://twitter.com/KristyHearts_05 Kristina

        You’re acting like I don’t know that the past affects the present. Actually I already hinted on everything you said. I don’t know, maybe you misunderstood what I was talking about/coming from….
        I didn’t say to “get over the past.” I said that it’s good to remember the past but move on. The world isn’t exactly the same as it was many years ago. 
        I still stand by on the fact the TigerJK did right to apologize. I also understand that Asians were being stereotyped. So yea…..
        Everyone can be a little racist but it’s still important to call it out when it’s out there.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

          No you completely missed my point. No one is using the past to hate a whole race. Im saying that this country is still affected by racism of the past, no one is looking at slavery/Jim Crow laws and are still being mad of over it, but alot people think of those days are over so its not so bad anymore but its still pretty bad. People are looking at how it has shaped America, the affects of that, and what needs to be dealt with to fix it. Hypothetically, if someone breaks there leg, can they move on from it or do they have to put treat it for it to get better, you can’t tell them to just leave it alone, move on and hope its get better, nope the legs still gonna be broke. The racism of the past was damaging, you can’t move on from a problem that hasn’t been solved. 

          What I mean about blaming you, is blaming whites of today for what whites did in the past, since you seem to think we are blaming you for your ancestors which we are not. Institutional racism is not in the past, its an affect of the past. I’m sorry but I don’t see anyone is this post talking about anything the past, unless they are relating it to what is happening now. The world is not like it was many years ago in sense that you can’t hang someone of another race and get away with, but we still have plenty of things we need to work on that is happening now. Move on means the same thing as get over it in my book. Please explain to me how move on, and get over it is different?

          • http://twitter.com/KristyHearts_05 Kristina

            …….hold up…..YOU THINK I’M WHITE?! You know what. I quit. I’m done. You said your point and I’ve said mine.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            I assumed you were white because you said we shouldn’t hate people for who their ancestors where which is a common thing a lot of white people say. I don’t see how it’s SMH matter honestly. 

  • Waetoria

    Korea is still very insular at best and very racist at worst. In such a homogenous and conformist society who took pride in blocking everyone out (remember Hermit Kingdom?), it’s not hard to see why the “other” (anyone Korean or not who doesn’t fit in within the “social norm”) is ostracized. As much as Koreans don’t fully get international standards of racial sensitivity, I think they also do not understand how the world views them. Of course the distorted media coverage doesn’t help things.

    Tiger JK seems to have lots of negative experiences from both whites and Koreans on racial issues (his own issues as well as having to take on those faced by his wife and son – it’s hard being biracial in Korea and I can’t even imagine the cruelties they must have faced). So maybe this was just the final trigger that made him explode. Not only was this insulting to him as a Korean, as an Asian man, but it degraded his pride as a respected hip hop artist. His race and his music are not a joke – which is how many people viewing Psy’s “Gangnam Style” video treat it, as something funny.

    I think he should have apologized and it’s good that he’s done so. But he also brings to light a critical topic – how Psy, Korea and the Asian world are viewed in the eyes of white people, or generally, in the eyes of the western world. Tiger sure as hell does not want to fill the Asian stereotype role but Psy and so many other Koreans either do not know that they are being viewed this way or don’t care because it’s lucrative or prestigious or [insert positive adjective here]. This episode should serve as a jumpoff point within Korea on discussions of race as well as REAL perceptions of Psy in American media – because unless you are blind and dumb, you can see from Amy’s examples in Ellen and Chelsea Handler that he isn’t exactly revered but rather laughed along with (laughed at, if you’re a pessimist). 

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

      Thank you! That’s what I’m saying, his episode was a result of a bigger problem but that people are totally dismissing. Yes, he could have handled it better, but some of his points were valid.

    • peachstem

      “This episode should serve as a jumpoff point within Korea on discussions of race as well as REAL perceptions of Psy in American media – because unless you are blind and dumb, you can see from Amy’s examples in Ellen and Chelsea Handler that he isn’t exactly revered but rather laughed along with (laughed at, if you’re a pessimist).”

      Ellen and Chelsea Handler are only TWO examples from the media. They also have a comedic focus in their talk shows rather than having serious interviews. They poke fun out of every guest or topic that comes up.

      What do you mean by “REAL” perceptions of Psy in American media? For those “white people” out there in the media – like Ryan Seacrest – who are treating him with respect, that’s not REAL? Because it doesn’t fit into your notion that Psy MUST be appreciated by white people for the ONLY reason that he fulfills a certain stereotype about Asians? And anyone who doesn’t see it as such is considered “blind and dumb”? Honest questions.

      • Waetoria

        Fair questions. I should qualify my statements by saying this is based on my experience with my friends and people around me, who encompass a full array of races and ethnicities – black, white, Asian, Latino. The general perception of Psy is more funnyman than musician.

        I guess my point on how the American media has treated Psy is that it’s awesome that he’s getting on all these super prominent shows but he isn’t given the same level of deference as other musicians. And I know that Chelsea  Handler isn’t to be taken at face value, but it just doesn’t help that he played the role that he did. 

        Actually since his first few appearances, he and the hosts have a much better rapport. It’s a blessing and a curse for him in a way cause he’s getting massive exposure but at the same time, the Korean media is treating him like the second coming of Christ and he has a lot of expectations on his shoulders now. And I’m just afraid other Korean companies will just imitate what he did and make all of Korean music look like a big farce.

      • jesuis2

         Yeah, the same Chelsea Handler who did the whole ‘Ching chong” bit.

  • Waetoria

    Perhaps the best thing Tiger JK could have done is called those hecklers out. He could have stopped his music and brought the guys onto the stage and asked them, “Why do you want me to do the horse dance? I’m not Psy, our music styles are very different and I’m here to perform my own work.” What can those guys say? “Um…cause you’re Asian and in music so you must be Psy?” No, they would have been ashamed and embarrassed and Tiger would’ve made his point without going down to their level.

  • http://twitter.com/Polk___A__Dot Ashley Polk

    Instead of restating what alot of others have said, I will just say this:
    I agree with amy.
    Racism= prejudice +power (AKA White supremacy) 
    For those of you who can’t understand (or try NOT to understand) I think comedian Paul Mooney says it best.

    • MAR_M3anie

      Yeeees! Paul Mooney always brings it home.

    • Truthlover77

      Good response, I think people tend to sweep history under the rug a lot so I’m glad you brought it up.

    • OhJisHo

      Historical context cannot be discounted.  This is true.  Europe did get a little big for it’s britches and tried to take over the world at one point.  In regards to historical context though Japan tried to take over Korea and China and tried to ‘put them back in their place’ when they tried to revolt.  Even took away Korea’s right to speak their own native language at one point.  The Romans took over more than half of the known globe at their time of power.  Even now, in Zimbabwe, Robert Mugabe is known worldwide for his racist attitudes and actions toward the white people in his country.  What you point out is true regarding European Colonialism, but to completely ignore other historical events that happen against other races by other races is also a form of trying to not understand and trying to pigeon hole racism as exclusive to one race. Racism is, unfortunately, not exclusive to one race.

      • http://twitter.com/Polk___A__Dot Ashley Polk

        Yes the Japanese expanded, and the Romans did too. For the Romans though, it was a little bit different because in the ancient times there was no concept of race. The world back then was dived by religion and language. even the Romans/Greeks did not want to be associated with the “barbarians of the North” The very concept of race did not come to being until the 1700’s when Europeans when to the “new world”. Yes others in the past have subjugated and oppressed others, I agree with you on that, but it was different because the social construct of race did not exist. But hey, don’t take my word for it. research it yourself. (Sexism did, and religious distrust did. (see crusades))

        ” also a form of trying to not understand and trying to pigeon hole
        racism as exclusive to one race. Racism is, unfortunately, not exclusive
        to one race.”

        This sounds like the five year old argument of “well they did it too!” 1. Does it make it right? 2. One could say that others could have ,made the concept of race… yaddah yaddah yaddah, but guess what? It didn’t end up that way. We need to focuse on the present, if we want to create a better future.

        The concept of race can be explained by Tim Wise (this is just a clip but you really should watch the whole thing. Its really good, and insightful.)

        • OhJisHo

          So the Japanese expanding against China and Korea wasn’t because of race issues? Robert Mugabe doesn’t fit into the racism category because he doesn’t subscribe to the white supremacy mindset? I will give you the Romans on the race side of things, but then that could possibly fall under the category of splitting hairs since at the time there were many races clustered into that area of the world and the term ‘barbarians of the North’ could be translated as possible racism and possibly not because it was the majority against the minority, with the Southern races not wanting anything to do Northern races. 

          I guess my main point – which I didn’t articulate well enough – is that hate is hate regardless of which race it comes from or whatever term one wants to call it by i.e. racism, predujice, discrimination due to religion, appearance etc.  By saying it is unfortunate that racism isn’t exclusive to one race, I wasn’t argueing from a childish mindset or allowing it because ‘they did it too’, but from an adult one that lays blame at the feet of everyone.  Hate begets hate.  Yes, the Europeans were wrong in demolishing native people of the lands they conquered and pushing their own agenda.  The individuals that sold their countrymen to the Europeans were wrong in what they did.  The majority of the world has been guilty of these actions at one point in time or another in their own countries history’s and I don’t believe it will be the last of this issue sadly.  To negate an entire race by saying reverse racism doesn’t exist or it is only because of white supremacy that the world is in the state it is in just seems innaccurate and skewed. The ones in power won’t change until the ones lacking it change their views and move forward.  The ones in power are, in actuality, the minority.  The majority are the ones that carry the bulk of the responsibility to move history forward toward a brighter future with less hate on all sides of the equation. 

          I will have to check out those videos.  Thanks!

          • Waetoria

            Agree that hate is hate, let’s not split hairs. What’s kind of ironic is that white people are actually the minority in the world based on pure numbers.

          • theonetwo

            i agree and yet some people here place blame on all white people instead of looking beyond that viewpoint and the cycle of hate continues.

        • Waetoria

          The social construct of race did not exist but severe prejudice based on ethnicities is essentially along the same lines as racism no?

          And I disagree that racism can only be practiced by whites. Tim Wise has a very Euro-centric view. As OhJisHo has said, the Japanese colonized Korea and annexed Manchuria and planned on conquering all of Asia based on their believe in the superiority of the Japanese race. In a broader sense, Tim Wise’s thesis is one of many definitions of racism.

  • saroj khan

    poeple dont really realise how racism affects a person if they have never been in that situation.from what i can see –tiger jk and his family probably deals with this evryday .so this resentment or feelings  might have accumulated over the time ,this incident just triggered all these feelings .he apologised so that says a lot.

    on the other hand–gagnam is like number one at australia.people dont really care about psy or the music .they just think he is funny so psy is just seen as funny asian.so i  think the popularity of the song itself should be questioned.i hope it does not become one hit wonder cuz psy is a really talented performer.

  • gowhalego

    Regarding the definition of racism as privilege + power, is it still considered racism when one minority race discriminates against another minority race? E.g. Koreans making fun of Chinese. Since neither groups have any institutional power whatsoever. 

    Would be interested to see how the author of this article answers this question. 

    • hapacalgirl

       That is a question I am wondering as well.  To use myself as an example, whenever I state that I am half asian / half white (usually because someone asked what I was), the first question I always get is “what is your other half” and when I state filipino, 8/10 of the times I have this discussion with any of my asian friends they will state “oh that isn’t really asian”, ummm what?  Last time I checked the Philippines was part of Asia.  Also another thing I have noticed among the asian community as a whole especially among the asian community I met during undergrad at Cal (where my asian friends ranged from Chinese/Korean/Japanese/Taiwanese/Lao etc.) is that there was this across the board superiority complex that many asians who are members of the more developed countries (Korea/Japan/China for example) feel they have over the lesser developed asian countries (Philippines, Laos, Vietnam, etc.).  Some of the things I have heard my Chinese and Korean friends say about filipinos and vietnamese even off the cuff were appalling to say the least. 

      So what I want to know is in this situation where you have certain asian races with dominance and power being prejudiced to members of less developed countries, would you consider this racism? 

      • theonetwo

        trust me,  you dont have to be white to disagree with the author or those who agree with the article.

        the superiority complex that you mention in the asian community is very real.  people want to only look at white people as if they are the only ones going around discriminating but asians also do it to other asians.

        • hapacalgirl

          Its interesting because in my experience I have found asians to be some of the most racist/prejudiced individuals to not only other asians but members of other ethnicities as a whole.

          • theonetwo

            i completely agree with your post. 

          • flamey124

            As an Asian myself, I think that there are some points I should clarify.

            I think you mean that members of more developed Asian countries discriminate against those who come from less developed countries, and also that Asians look down on some people of different ethnicities, eg. Latino.

            1) Small point, but – I’m not exactly sure that it can be called racism when it’s “Asian” against “Asian”, given that Asians are a whole mixed bag of races (eg. Singapore is majority Chinese, but I don’t think you’d call it a Chinese country). Discrimination, yes.

            2) Look at who they discriminate against and who they want to be like. They discriminate, but there’s also this overwhelming fascination with stuff that’s perceived as ‘white’. Eg. Brands. Gucci, Prada, Givenchy etc. Marketing strategy of Tiger Beer, for example, pitches it as a “European-Style” Lager in Asian countries and “Made in the East” (not even Asian, but some exotic East) when marketing to UK and US. Promotional videos from stuff like AScience, haircare marketed at the Asian market, is largely concerned with a beautiful Asian women stepping into a strange concert hall filled with “Westerners” and wowing them with her beauty.

            I believe that this fascination with stuff from the West has its historical roots in the phenomenon of colonialism. So the phenomenon of “racism” in Asians, as you term it (personally I find it quite problematic because ‘Asia’ covers India, Japan, China, Singapore, Vietnam, Cambodia etc etc, countries that are so entirely different in many ways) is not as simplistic as ‘oh, I just dislike someone else because they are different’.

            3) So in conclusion, of course we all don’t want discrimination and prejudice to continue. Of course it’s always wrong. But I think that having a simplistic definition of racism and not looking at the causes that bring about racism, in fact simply writing it off as ‘that’s dumb to do’, might be very damaging as well.

          • peachstem

            Hmm, to your second point:

            Do you really think it’s about being attracted to what’s from the “white” culture or simply liking something that is sophisticated and recognized by the world as something “classy” and expensive?

            As far as I know, there are not many Asian brands of fashion, let’s say, that stand equally (internationally) among the brands you listed. As an Asian and knowing many Asian people in my life, the reason why so many people of my culture go for those brands you call “white” brands or European brands, is because of the connection to the upper class, not because they “want to be white” or something.

        • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

          Shouldn’t you say that SOME Asians also do it to other Asians or else you are lumping all Asians together and not seeing them as individuals since not all Asian think the same. If your going to do that then you are racist hypocrite and now your point is invalid. See how derailing works? 

          • theonetwo

            yep, some asians do it to other asians.  you are absolutely correct.  forgot to add that important word “SOME”. notice how i didnt say ALL asians but i guess you took it and ran with it lol 

            oh, but wait, youre going to defend tiger jk, saying his racist rant filled with a whole bunch of expletives is valid but not my mistake of not adding the word “some” in my post?  lol hilariousl.  so i guess youre a hypocrite as well?  how nice.  join the party.

            oh, but wait yet again.  im not white so i guess im not racist according to some people posting here.  im only prejudice and discriminating because asians cant be racist because we have dont have any “power.” lucky me.

            how is it derailing when im talking about whats written in the article?  lol

          • flamey124

            Haha theonetwo, chill, JasmineA’s just pointing out things that people will think about your argument. So isn’t it good that you got to clarify it anyway.

            Anyway

            1) Please don’t write off JasmineA as simply defending Tiger JK, she’s just pointing out deeper reasons behind why JK did the things he did.

            2) I didn’t see her saying anywhere that “his racist rant filled with a whole bunch of expletives…was valid” the way you thought she did, maybe you can point out where she did say that, in order to be fair to her argument as well.

            3) You’re talking about one specific point in the article, that you think he should apologize. Probably he should have. But we’re just pointing out what might have driven him to do so.

            Don’t look at the argument we’re making as
            Complex societal factors caused him to do so, therefore should he really have apologized = what he did was right.

            No one is making that logical jump. Don’t keep saying that we did and we are ignoring that he generalized and looked prejudiced against white people. We didn’t say that. We just want a discussion on what drove him to do so.

            Simply saying that “he was wrong, he should have apologized, end of story” blocks out discussion on this possible cultural phenomenon of racism that could have affected JK and other Asians as well.

          • theonetwo

            let me clarify some things to you. 

            i totally get it.  i do.  i understand all about how some people view asians. im just not going to make that leap and say an entire race feels that way about asians.

            ive been discriminated by every race. whites, blacks, hispanics and  yes, even other asians and whether people want to call it racism, discrimination, or prejudice it pretty much feels like the same damn thing.

            now, i understand what people here and what people like tiger jk are trying to say.  i just dont understand how some people can label all white people a certain way when we all know all white people arent that way.  that kind of thinking just breeds more hate.

            i just dont understand tiger jk’s rational when hes such a huge advocate against racism but yet he then goes off on white people.  not some white people i remind you.  ALL white people.  that just blows my mind. 

            what lead up to him exploding like that?  i dont know but he should have know better especially with his background dealing with such things and the fact his family is biracial.

            i completely respect that he apologized but at the same time it doesn’t excuse his actions whether his points were valid or not. 

            hypothetical example –

            thats like me being famous and a huge advocate against domestic violence and then becoming so enraged one day that i wooped the shit out of my girlfriend for whatever reason and afterwards apologizing and saying its wrong.  yes, we can go into my past and try to figure why i would do such things.  was it because i was raised by a single parent?  was it because i was abused?  was it because one of my parents were abused by the other?

            now, the example i gave is extreme and skewed in my favor but it doesnt change the fact that the act was wrong and some people are going to take my words after that incident with a grain of salt.

            i know tiger jk isnt racist but his credibility on the subject, while not completely destroyed did take a little hit with me but again, thats just me.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            You have every right to get upset about the ALL white people statement. But if you understand what other people are saying, why is that the only thing you seem to focus on? 

          • theonetwo

            there is racism in every community.  i never said there  wasnt. 

            Tiger jk just didn’t point that out.  i would have been fine if he acted professionally and handled the situation better.  instead, he went and put down an entire race while doing so.  his quote, “F*** all the white people.” 

            that irked me because of tiger jk’s background.  i was just really disappointed with the guy.

            now, i try to give people the benefit of the doubt but its hard to look away from a comment like that.

            you say i didnt add the word some to my comment and fine.  if you feel i grouped all asians together then so be it.  hopefully others might have given me the benefit of the doubt.  saying that, i didnt say all asians so my comment isnt specific or concrete like tiger jk’s was.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            Like I said you only focus on specific part of it and dismiss the rest, thats what I mean by derailment. Secondly I never said you were white.

            Where do you keep getting the idea that I am defending Tiger JK for the all white people statement? I merely defending the parts I agree with. Never did I say he was in the right for saying f white people, you just keep putting those words in my mouth. 

          • theonetwo

            read some of these posts and some people are defending tiger jk’s action.  in fact some say good for him and he shouldnt apologize.

            really?  wow …

            anyways, if youre not in that group then i apologize for making it seem that way.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

            Yeah, I read them and don’t agree with that. I think we just kept getting misunderstood by each other maybe…

      • Waetoria

        From my experience, Asians are some of the most racist people I know. Or they are the most blatantly racist. I find it all very sad.

        • http://twitter.com/dds87 dechen

          have to agree >>>>> some of my own relatives are guilty of discriminating and being a racist….Sad, but true ..smh

          • peachstem

            As an Asian I don’t consider myself racist as I believe in being colorblind.

            But I can PERSONALLY attest to the shared racist mentality of many of my older relatives, parents and my parents’ friends. This could be due to their “older generation” background but it also completely blows out of the water the idea that only white people can be racist.

            My parents have had said things like, “You can marry an Asian but not a black, white or Mexican person.” They even have preferences as to marrying an Asian from my parents’ particular country than an Asian from somewhere else.

          • theonetwo

             yeah,  im sure a lot of asians go through what you have went through.

        • jesuis2

          Discriminating against Asians of other ethnicities is not racism (after all, they are all of the same race – Asian)

          It was the whites who started the whole superiority based on race thing.

          • peachstem

            “Discriminating against Asians of other ethnicities is not racism (after all, they are all of the same race – Asian)”

            This is a flawed concept to me because some Asian cultures don’t consider themselves as part of this “unity” of the many ethnicities combined to make this “Asian race.” Some Asian cultures place “Korean” or “Japanese” etc. etc. as a race itself separate from Asian. There is an “us vs. them” mentality that I find is common among many Asian countries, especially ones that value nationalism. If Asians don’t think of themselves as “being in the same race” then your definition is not valid or realistic for those who believe that a specific kind of Asian is separate (or superior) from the whole.

            I have heard about Koreans equating nationality with a single ethnic group/race, meaning anyone who is not born and raised in Korea is not considered Korean. Even Koreans who were born there and raised for part of their childhood but also grown up overseas are not considered “Korean.” Koreans are racist towards Korean Americans or at least employ the SAME TACTICS that racists use toward an undesired group. Koreans are even discriminatory towards native Koreans who don’t follow the conventional “Korean way” and these people are shunned like outcasts, with barely any of the rights or privileges that the majority who are “accepted ” enjoys.

            What about biracial children who is say, maybe half-Korean and half-Vietnamese/SE Asian? They can’t be racist toward the kid because he’s still “all Asian”? Even if these kids are beaten up and called derogatory names by “pure” majority children due to their heritage/race/nationality/ethnicity/etc? Or how about a half-Korean and half-black child? How can they discriminate against half of a person? A biracial child is still part Asian and part black, and from the experience of many biracial people in my life, saying that a biracial person is not “really Asian” or not “really black” is EXTREMELY insulting. So you see, racism and discrimination is not the black and white definition as you put it. It varies with each environment, culture, demographic, location, etc.

            Whether or not you define it as “racism” because they are the same race of Asian or whatever, is obviously not how many Asian people see it. Hate is hate, regardless of how you spin it.

      • jesuis2

         That’s not racism, it’s nationalism/ethnocentrism.

        You don’t think Northern Western Europeans don’t look upon Southern or Eastern Europeans the same way?

        Or for that matter, the English when it comes to the Scots and Irish?

    • http://twitter.com/Polk___A__Dot Ashley Polk

       Maybe it would fall inter inter-ethnic prejudice. I mean look at all the ethnic “cleansing” problems of Eastern europe. I know that sometimes it can be called colorism… for example” Light skin Blacks have more privileges than darker skin blacks.

  • Truthlover77

    To think this article would cause this much reaction in people. I do agree with Amy that reverse racism doesn’t exist mainly due to fact that Whites rule/are/have oppressed every continent on this planet. If you look back on history this would give you CLEAR facts, i just don’t feel like teaching a history lesson right now. You see Racism is like a bully that keeps picking on a person, over and over again. Think of it this way, If bullies (representing racism) kept picking on you, you would eventually develop this anger and hatred towards them and everyone who these bullies have a connection to, this can mean their family, friends whatever(this represent a particular race) and Prejudice would be born. Well in a similar way, this is what happens when people go though oppression from another race (particular whites due to the white superiority thing they got going on). They develop these negatives feelings and because the same race keeps picking on them, they begin to feel that hmm maybe all people who are this race or color are all the same. Ladies and gentlemen, this what we call PREJUDICE. The RESULT of racism. Its hurts when you think about too, that this evil cycle is keeping all of us down. Its blinding and choking us. I can simply understand why tiger jk went off like he did . He probably had many bad experiences with whites and flashbacks along with being provoke by the particular individuals in the audience. Most people in this situation would probably do the same thing. I mean come on, have some mercy on the guy. Although Its good he was better person to apologize (he does have to keep a good reputation as a famous person).

    On another note, about Psy. I think its awesome that psy came to america. However, I don’t think people will take him serious in america probably due to stereotypes and crap. Of course if you look different and try to make it big, you’re going to go through some trials. Unfortunately, now people who are ignorant are going believe the stereotypes about asian men (and asian in general) even more and run with it.

    • jessoa

       History says that not all white countries ruled or oppressed. Some white countries were the ones who were oppressed

      • Truthlover77

        Thats white counties. Of course european countries have been oppressed by the same race.

  • pamrawr

    1. Good on him for ranting, he’s not perfect. Must of really pissed him off. I know it’s pissed me off sometimes.

    2. Good on him for apologising. Despite the whole “not perfect” thing, he does have a lot of fans that look up to him. Apologising isn’t just being sorry for what you said, its for also understanding the consequences due to your actions and taking responsibility for what you’ve done. That should be given by now folks. Aren’t we all used to the amount of apologies we get from the KPOP industry?

    3. His rant brought a serious topic into the light that would of been buried underneath the PSY phenomenon, which is the stereotyping of Asians and the ignorance of society on both sides. 

    So in conclusion, guys clear your mind and focus on the issue at hand and not Tiger JK. What he’s done is dine, you can’t do anything about it.. You can approve or disapprove, it ain’t gonna change nothing. 
    I believe reverse racism does exist. Or maybe it’s better described as a racist cycle. Whites (being the ones in power, hello history) being pricks to asians, asians retaliating and forming their own, distorted opinions about whites. Just as an example of course.  

    • hapacalgirl

      THANK YOU!  Considering Tiger JK , a man who rarely minces his words and rarely backs down from a statement, realized that he did something wrong and apologized for it I don’t know why there is this argument about it, the man himself felt he needed to apologize and he did, end of story  As a person who is an advocate of racial understanding and fighting racism he understood that in that heat of the moment he did exactly what he is trying to prevent , which is he made a statement that showed prejudice over an entire group based on the actions of a few.  He stood by what he was saying but admitted where he crossed the line.  We can go on and on and on for days on what racism is which at the end of the day will change based on the individual’s life and whether they follow a certain school of thought on the subject but the fact is racism and prejudice is wrong PERIOD, even if it is against the oh so powerful white people as everyone here is stating.  Just like it isn’t right for whites to be discriminatory on other races, it isn’t right for those races to be discriminatory to other races and to whites, because in the end the group being discriminated against will form distorted opinions on those who are discriminating and being prejudiced against them and then it becomes this viscous cycle. 

      • theonetwo

         have to agree

  • eternalstars

    Okay, I can completely understand where he’s coming from, and I actually really appreciate his ranting. And I mostly agree with this article. Except for the reverse racism bit. So maybe he wasn’t strictly being “racist”, according to Amy’s definition. But he was still being prejudiced. You can’t excuse his prejudiced rant just because he’s not being “racist”. Retaliating by stereotyping white people in turn definitely isn’t going to make this whole racism thing better – it just makes you a hypocrite. And the fact that he was doing exactly the same thing that those horse-dance-demanders were doing (i.e. stereotying race) means that he WAS being a bit of a hypocrite. But honestly, I’m not here to criticise him. I can completely see why it pissed him off, why he acted like he did, and I’m glad that someone has publicly brought this whole issue to light, if only for a little while. And I also admire how he apologised. Because I really think he should’ve, given that he said some things he shouldnt’ve, and obviously he recognised that too, so the fact that he apologised means he ends up being the better man in this whole situation.

    But gosh, I seriously do understand why he lost it. The number of times I’ve gotten pissed about Asian stereotypes in the media…yeah, I completely get it.

  • http://thefutureisidol.com/ Mis

    I agree with this article. Just wish that I could express my (very similar) opinions on this in discussions with non-whites (and especially “Asians”) without coming off as a white know-it-all. I don’t want to make anyone feel as I (as a queer woman) feel when straight men lecture me on feminism.

  • VIPUSA

    Great article and really good points. Eventhough, I don’t listen to Tiger JK, I totally understand where he is coming from and his rant is valid, I mean you are doing your show and then out of the blue you get random people asking you to do the “horse dance” every minute? I mean who is been disrespectful here. I really like that he apologize and gave his side of the story, he knows that what he said wasn’t pretty, but he has the right to rant.
    As for PSY I applaud him for what he has done and for that tiny windown that he is opening for Kpop, yet I don’t think Kpop will take root in US. Everyone that I know loves PSY cause he looks “funny” dances “funny” and dresses “funny”, and thinks that every Korean pop artist is like PSY, if that is not stereotype then what is?….Also, we need to realized that language is a huge barrier, PSY was able to get by, because the MV is appealing, the dance move is cute and cause the song has a great beat, but do I honestly think that other Kpop artist are going to get by that easily? NO specially if you want your music to be taken serioulsy. PSY is a great enternainer and I’m happy with his success, yet  his success has brought a double edge to sword to KPop, cause from now on the American market is going to expect another “PSY” and another “Horse Dance”.
    Actually, PSY remimds me of Ricky Martin back in 1998 when he crossover to the American market with “La Vida Loca” that song was the song heard in every corner of America and everyone and their dogs danced to it…and what the Americans thought about every Hispanic/Latino that everyone in the community danced like Ricky and overnight the Latin community became the trend. Yes, Ricky helped the Latin musicians like Shakira, Enrique Iglesias and JLO get noticed, but what these artist had to do (except JLO), they had to sing in English and changed their Latin appeal in order to capture American audience. So my Kpop friends crossover is not easy and is very painful to see, belive me cause I have seen many Latin artist tried and failed.
    Kpop should focus in creating better music, perfect their formulas and focus in the global market and home market, instead of this idea of “making it”.

  • sleepyboo

    I completely agree with this article, he had nothing to apologize for. People are walking around with this messed up mindset that victims of racism need to be “politely angry”. That they have to remain calm when calling people out for their racism, be the ones to educate them, explain why it’s wrong. This is complete BULLSH*T. 

    There is nothing polite about racism. There is nothing polite about being humiliated, there’s nothing polite about being made to feel inferior, there is nothing polite about being made a joke and expected to shuck and jive for other peoples entertainment. Why did Jk have to handle this differently? To avoid hurting peoples feelings? Hurt feelings are not racism! Nothing he said is going to change the amount of power white people have. It’s not going to cause them to be denied housing, a job, have them be followed around in stores, have them be shot for “looking suspicious”, and it’s NOT going to have them all be stereotyped in the media as sexless, fat men who dance funny (because lets be real this what a good portion of America sees when they see Psy).

    He had two people demand he be their clown, you know “like that other funny Asian guy”. Tiger Jk is the victim here and I’m tired of people’s justified anger towards racist remarks being described as “over-reacting”. Frankly, it is completely disgusting that what’s constantly being discussed is his reaction, not the cause behind his reaction, and not the racist motivations behind the white audience members demands.

    • AreumJ

       Bravo, I agree wholeheartedly with you!

  • trublu59

    As an Asian American, I’ve had a lot of similar thoughts to what you’ve expressed. With Psy’s success, I wasn’t surprised at the whole incident. While Tiger JK’s racist remarks were uncalled for, I think his apology was more of a way to own up on his actions and for that I respect him even more.
    I’ve been reading through the comments about the reverse racism, and I get the whole point of white people’s history of being the oppressors, but that doesn’t mean reverse racism doesn’t exist and that other races have the “right” to be racist. Two wrongs do nothing but fuel the hate (as the recent incident seems to have done). The focus should be on learning and respect.
    As much as I think Psy’s success will continue to perceive the stereotypes of Asians being the funny ones, it could also help shed light on Korean/Asian culture as a whole and open doors to possibilities of learning.

  • http://twitter.com/palmadecoco Amanda

    I completely agree with this article as well. Thank you, seriously, for this. 

  • http://mithunonthe.net/ Mithun Divakaran

    “… racist view of Asians as service people, as sexless individuals”

    I believe that’s mainly the men they like to portray. Asian woman on the other hand, I think we all know how they are portrayed.

  • Pitch Black

    I’d like to enquire as to the ethnic background of the author so I can contextualize what I’m reading… Are you writing this from the point of view of a white foreigner abroad/ white foreigner in Korea/ korean american/ korean?

    • hapacalgirl

      I am pretty sure Amy is Asian-American (as to which specific ethnicity I do not know and will not assume) as she has appeared (very rarely) on the videos that ellie and sometimes nia used to do in the early days of seoulbeats.  I could be wrong but I don’t think she is Korean and I am pretty sure she doesn’t live abroad.

      • Pitch Black

        Ok, assuming that is the case…
        “I’m not offended at all. You don’t need to justify it. And I won’t judge you either.” (from article)
        What right does she have to say that she’s not offended if she isn’t white?? Of course she’s not offended- his tirade at creators had nothing to do with her.
        As a ‘white boi’ living in Korea and a huge fan of drunken tiger, I had to deal with the embarassment of trying to justify what he’d said to the white friends that I’d bought along to the concert (“hey guys come check out my favorite hip-hop artist- you’ll love him”)

        The problem is that by not directing his anger at the people who were in the wrong (I was in the front row and had no idea that there were people on the side of the stage telling him to dance), he was ranting against in white people in the audience- 90% of whom have chosen to live amongst Koreans, most of whom for 1year+. I.e. they have a cultural sensitivity and wouldn’t group TigerJK in with another singer just because he looks Asian. I don’t see what possessed him to focus on the fact that the douchebags heckling him were white at all.

        He made a mistake and came across as prejudiced (racist)= he needed to apologize. And I’m glad he apologized to win back some of the respect from his white fans.

  • cancertwin2

    As a African American female living in America’s deep south, I get the whole minority oppression thing better than most people can know. My twin sister and I attend one of the best schools in our district which is primarily Caucasians and Asians. We are the only two black students in our honors courses. Due to long held racial stereotypes our classmates often seem perplexed at our high IQs partially because we look more Beyonce with glasses than female Steve Urkel. They expect us to be someone’s baby mama, not the only two students in the class with a 5.0 GPA weighted.

    However I do think that Tiger JK was right to apologize. His rebuke of the asinine hecklers was over the top and completely uncalled for. Especially as a person who deems himself as a champion for racial equality. That makes him a big hypocrite in my book.

    Whether people think that he wasn’t being racist or prejudiced doesn’t make him any less wrong nor does it excuse him from having to apologize. I respect him a bit more because he did, actually.

    One of my older cousin’s is an aspiring rapper. He and his crew frequently perform at local nightclubs and bars. There was this one time in which they performed for a mixed crowd and these Hispanics guys threw their beers at them shouting “N*ggas, get off the stage!” The crowd of whites, blacks, and latinos lambasted the hecklers for their rude behavior and they were promptly escorted out of the club by guards. What did my cousin and his crew do next? They continued to perform. After all they were getting paid for the gig and people had come to see them.

    That’s called being a professional.

    Of course they were very upset when they got offstage. If they had met up with those hecklers I’m quite sure fists would have been thrown. But that’s not the point.

    Various definitions and semantics are being toyed with by some of the commenters on this post. But at the end of the day everyone is capable of being a racist whether their racial group is seen as having “power” or not. I’ve seen it too many times with my own eyes to dismiss.

    There is so much I want to say but I’ll leave it here.

    In conclusion, though Tiger JK may not be a racist he did the right thing by apologizing because he was in the wrong. We can never know if those hecklers were racists based on their actions but he left no question in his hate filled rant what kinds of thoughts he has about people of different skin colors. Instead of trying to shove off blame to others, let’s just focus on that.

  • Chelsea Fisher

  • AreumJ

    Just think of it this way: When you have an angry outburst, don’t you say nasty things, which you don’t mean 100%, which you usually feel embarrassed/ guilty about later on?

    Also, when you are a victim of racism, you learn to really appreciate, love, and practice the concept of equality. You come to hate racism, and you try to embrace and cherish all of humanity, because you understand just how painful racism is. (Although none of us are perfect and we are prone to making mistakes)

    So I’m just saying, you can’t really classify Tiger JK as racist/prejudiced/hypocritical based on his angry rant. You would have to know him on a more personal level to determine something like that.

    • peachstem

      Just wanted to clarify a few things because your post kind of confuses me.

      If Tiger JK is a victim of racism, and understands how painful racism is, then shouldn’t he have NOT generalized all white people? As someone who supports “racial equality”, and yet still flings all those comments about white people in a very public way, isn’t that going back on the very idea that he claims to support? That outburst was in no way “embracing and cherishing all of humanity” IMO.

      “When you have an angry outburst, don’t you say nasty things, which you don’t mean 100%, which you usually feel embarrassed/ guilty about later on?”

      Is that an excuse for what he did? His outburst was much more than just “nasty things that he didn’t mean 100%.” If he feels embarrassed and guilty later on, then it makes sense that he should have apologized. If every person of public prominence tried to avoid responsibility and owning up to their mistakes by simply saying, “Oh, I was just mad” or even worse, going right up in the fangirls’ alley by saying “Oppa didn’t mean it!” – that kind of excuse would not fly with most people.

      TBH I think most people here aren’t calling Tiger JK a racist PERSON, but are arguing that what he SAID was racist. I think it would take more cases of outbursts like these before anyone labels him as a racist person.

      “So I’m just saying, you can’t really classify Tiger JK as racist/prejudiced/hypocritical based on his angry rant. You would have to know him on a more personal level to determine something like that.”

      That’s a confusing claim as well because like it or not Tiger JK IS the image he presents to the public. Not everyone in this world can know him personally, that’s impossible. Of course, everyone will have different perceptions of a celebrity or public figure but Tiger JK is VERY clear and vocal about his position against racism. And to turn around and say “fuck all white people” makes it a hypocritical STATEMENT.

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/XR2L6ZALLID5LP4B5DZFOQ3DXY Robert

        As a collective, white people are in power & their institutions of oppression including governments, proxies & military, continue to enforce their position in the global hierarchy after the centuries of raping, killing & stealing fun they had in non-white countries during the colonial times. The times that have ENRICHED their countries & provided well for their descendants at the expense of the non-white races. Whites are the conquerors, so no, you can’t be racist to the empowered “majority” with their overriding sense of entitlement & historical past. It’s akin to being a fly up the ass of an elephant. The fly’s harmless at best, irritating at worst. The fly can’t hurt the elephant but the reverse is simply not true. Easy enough a concept for you?

  • noiha

    i just want to say, it’s been a while since i read a really good article in seoulbeats. keep this coming~!

  • http://twitter.com/J2201987 Justin Asomugha

    I’m not sure if I agree with this article. Being a minority myself I can understand where Tiger JK is coming from and on some level even sympathize with the guy. But that whole diatribe was a bit hypocritical, if not racist in itself.

    I don’t think there would have been a problem, or the existence of this discussion, if Tiger JK would have just went in on the hecklers, as that would have been justified. But he took the whole situation and made it about white people saying “F*ck all of” them, and that’s unfair. It’s similar to the Kramer situation a few years ago; It wouldn’t have been a problem if he just clowned the hecklers in that club but he went into this huge tirade about black people and using all kinds of derogatory names.

    I do give JK some credit though in realizing the error of his ways and apologizing for what he said. It is said that when you’re battling the monsters in the world make sure you don’t become one yourself. Hopefully TJK can take more time and evaluate why he said what he said, because clearly there is some residual feelings surrounding the constant mention of his (family’s) racial make up.

    S/N I’ve read all of these comments and I’m trying to figure out where people are getting this “reverse racism” nonsense? When can racism be “reversed”? And why is it postulated that being racist is exclusive to white people? I mean, granted I’m aware of white privilege and how jews run the world, but this whole “reverse racism” concept (to me) implies that only white people can be racist. And I don’t know about the rest of the world, but here in ‘murrica, especially in the south, that couldn’t be further from the truth. I know Black people, Hispanic people, and White people say some of the most heinous things towards each other. Racism isn’t exclusive to one race, and as someone else pointed out, any derogatory statement or treatment or behavior change towards one person simply because of his/her skin color is racism. 

    • http://twitter.com/silverukiss Silver

       Exactly. Since when are only white people capable of being racist? I’m white because the gene pool decided I was going to look like my dad instead of my mother, but I don’t see how that has any bearing on whether I am capable of being racist or not.

      • http://profile.yahoo.com/XR2L6ZALLID5LP4B5DZFOQ3DXY Robert

        And with you being white, comes a whole treasure trove of white privileges that are closed off to other races. But first, members to the club have to deny its patently obvious existence.

      • plushiesexual

        They’re not saying that White people are the only ones who can have racist beliefs (prejudice), or the only ones who can apply these racist beliefs in their actions towards others (discrimination).
        What they ARE saying is that White people, as a race-based social group, are the ONLY racial social group with enough POWER to create racist oppression against other racial groups based on these actions (“be racist”). I realize this can be a tough concept to swallow, if you are a White person who as an individual have done nothing wrong, and yet have to accept that you benefit from the existing system that gives you privilege at the expense of others. What needs to be made clear:There is nothing wrong with being White. What’s wrong is that society is designed so that White people receive privilege based on the fact that they’re White, and dehumanize disempower and oppress other people based on the fact that they are not White.Hope you understand. (Just for the record, I don’t think it’s that productive to just run around telling White people that you can’t “be racist” against them, if they don’t even understand the full meaning of what “being racist” is in the first place ( = creating racial social oppression, based on racial prejudice/discrimination). In the end, it just creates divisions against groups of people and is counterproductive to helping them understand what’s wrong.)

        • http://twitter.com/silverukiss Silver

           A well thought out answer. I can respect that.

          • 3MKMK

            I am black and I think it is wrong to look at racism that way. I have seen black, white, asian people say the most heinous hurtful things based on race. I have had friends who went to Korea to teach, that have had racist like actions against them because they are black and I do STRESS that this was a few individuals that did this, not that all Koreans are racist or Korea as a country is. So NOOOOOOO it is not only White people, with  enough power to create racist opression, it is anybody with a mouth and their actions. Just like Tiger JK was troubled or felt oppressed by what they did, so have the black people felt oppressed and troubled by the individuals who were racist against them in Korea…. Anybody has that power to oppress another based on their race depending on your actions towards some one based on their race, not just white people. 

  • jesuis2

    Psy’s popularity in the US (as well as elsewhere) is largely due to the fact that he conforms to the funny-looking, singing/dancing Asian male, much like the infamous William Hung on America Idol.

    That’s why we still largely see the same type of roles for Asian males in Western media – the character of Han Lee in “2 Broke Girls”, Ken Jeong in “The Hangover” films and pretty much everything else he does, the “The Amazing” Yen in “Ocean’s 11/12/13″ as the short Asian guy w/ the heavy FOB accent.

    Not much diff. from the days of Long Duk Dong in “Sixteen Candles” or Mickey Rooney doing yellowface in “Breakfast at Tiffany’s.”

    • peachstem

      “Psy’s popularity in the US (as well as elsewhere) is largely due to the fact that he conforms to the funny-looking, singing/dancing Asian male, much like the infamous William Hung on America Idol.”

      Psy wasn’t CONFORMING to any “Asian male” concept, his concept IS dancing and singing and looking funny, BOTH in Korea and in the US. In fact I APPLAUD his efforts in staying true to his personality and workmanship versus manufacturing himself to what Americans “stereotypically want”, like how many Kpop idols are trying to do now to break into the US. In fact, I’d argue that Psy’s popularity has rather to do with bringing something fresh and different to the American market rather than befitting “white people’s” stereotypes about Asians. Psy is rapping fluently in Korean rather than speaking English in an Asian accent. Can you please find me more examples OTHER than William Hung that embody the “singing/dancing Asian male” stereotype? The other examples you listed, at least to my knowledge, are acting roles rather than pop music culture figures and those two are vastly different categories.

      “Just like Tiger JK was stereotyped as a Korean/Asian male performer in being stupidly asked to do Psy’s dance, many Asian boys growing up were stereotyped as Long Duk Dong, William Hung, Jackie Chan or Bruce Lee (some might think the Bruce Lee thing is a positive, but it’s not).”

      Do you have personal experience of this or are you just repeating the dogma of other people’s theories? I live in a large metropolitan area so maybe I have a different experience. But these “many Asian boys” you are talking about, who grew up alongside with me, have never or rarely experienced those stereotypes. In fact, many look up to Jackie Chan, Bruce Lee, etc. as role models or inspirations and are glad they have found a niche in the US – because let’s face it, there were little to none Asian actors in American media generations ago.

      As to William Hung, I found him just as hilarious as any other white person would have (I’m Asian). The reason why I’m laughing at him is because he is super nerdy and sang terribly – he probably auditioned as a joke. If a super nerdy white person or a black person came to audition with a nasally voice, weirdly jerky dance and high-waisted pants, I don’t believe the reaction would have been any different. BAD AUDITIONS on American Idol will get poked fun at no matter what – it’s a part of the REALITY aspect of the show.

      “Not much diff. from the days of Long Duk Dong in “Sixteen Candles” or Mickey Rooney doing yellowface in “Breakfast at Tiffany’s.”

      Breakfast at Tiffany’s was released in the 60s. Do you think anyone today would get away with doing yellowface? The Jeremy Lin article about the “Chink in the Armor” received massive backlash.

      “Note how in “The Hangover” films there are attractive AFs, but coupled w/ WMs.”

      To my knowledge there was only ONE Asian female/white male couple in the Hangover films, and her character was Thai American and speaks perfect English. Her parents speak accented English because they are native Thai. Do you think every person in Thailand speaks English perfectly with an American accent without having spent any time in a western country? Her character is attractive because almost EVERY female role in this kind of genre (or I’d argue for almost EVERY female celebrity of her age and youth has a certain beauty standard that is supposed to be met) is supposed to be beautiful. As for her small role with not many lines, the reason is because this movie is focused on the men enjoying their bachelor’s party and the women in the film are given VERY little parts throughout the series – this is also true for the WHITE women in past Hangover films.

      Also, that argument that Asian women MUST be paired with Asian men pisses me off. I don’t understand how people support racial equality, interracial relationships and being “colorblind” and yet expect WOMEN to date the men of their race. Why is that expectation placed upon Asian women (or Latina or black or white women)? Why does nobody complain when men date outside of their race? Or how is it fair when white women/Asian man pairings are somehow hailed as a triumph? We are NOT YOUR PROPERTY. I can date whom I wish. And I’d appreciate it if embittered, lonely, sexually frustrated, resentful Asian men who make those stupid comments blaming everything on racism and “white guys taking away OUR women” – *eye roll* – realize that I am dating who I want through free choice (the truth hurts). Women who refuse to date from their own race for whatever reservations they have – whether they learned it from the media, their friends, life experience, etc. – are letting other people or single experiences decide how they live their lives and that is their consequence.

      And for the record I appreciate men of all ethnic backgrounds, from those opposite to my own or from those very similar to mine.

      • igbygrl

        “Breakfast at Tiffany’s was released in the 60s. Do you think anyone today would get away with doing yellowface? The Jeremy Lin article about the “Chink in the Armor” received massive backlash.”

        They still do today…Movies like The Last Airbender and the new movie with Doona Bae in Cloud Atlas still has the classic yellow face syndrome.

        • peachstem

          They may still DO it in Hollywood but they definitely don’t “get away with it” like they would have in the past. Fans protested, accused the filmmakers of racism, wrote letter campaigns and even organized boycotts. The film was controversial to say the least, both with fans and expert critics. The film also basically flunked critically and commercially (although reasons for that can be anything). Can you still call that “getting away with it”? The intense fan reactions were so noticeable and strong that Paramount and the director were required to release statements on their behalf, and even offered to let the boycotters screen the film after they completed the movie. You also forget to mention that M. Night Shyamalan (the director, writer and producer) is Asian and so is Dev Patel who played Zuko, a role that is as equally prominent and important as Aang and Katara. Unless you don’t count Indians as “Asian” and then I have no nothing else left to say.
          Noah Ringer who played Aang wasn’t even an actor before the movie. He had been practicing Taekwondo for years and even earned champion awards for it. From what I’ve read, he shaved his head during practice to cool off and other people nicknamed him Avatar because of his resemblance to Aang. He made an audition tape practicing with his instructor and he was casted for his striking resemblance to the main character. His experience in martial arts probably was a deciding factor in his casting, as I believe Dev Patel (who played Zuko) had to go under intensive training to learn how to fight for the movie.
          Did you even watch the movie or the series? It seemed like the director split the various bending elements into races (East Asians for earthbending, South Asians for firebending, Caucasians for waterbending – in the series Airbenders were considered extinct except for Aang so him being played by a white actor does not bother me at all – in fact when I first saw the trailer I remember my first impression was that he looks almost exactly like Aang from the series). It definitely makes logical sense that Asians will be cast for Earthbenders and Firebenders because in the cartoon series, the cities were designed with a very “Asian” style and M. Night follows through with portraying the people as such. The Waterbenders’ culture from the north and south pole are basically tribal and live in igloos. Does that mean they have to be Asian? Katara’s eyes are BLUE. How many Asians do you know have naturally blue eyes? In the real world, people living up north in Europe or northern Asia (Russia) are generally paler than those from southern countries and I don’t see it as a HUGE difference that white people would be living in communities in the north/south pole in Avatar. I would assume that if the second and third movies of the planned trilogy came to completion (doubt it now because it tanked so miserably in the box office), Toph would be played by an Asian female because she would be from the Earthbender’s country. I am guessing she would be introduced in the second film, as in the series Toph doesn’t appear and join the group until much later. She is not part of the “original three” of Aang, Sokka and Katara.
          It constantly surprises me when people just pull facts from random arguments without doing the proper research. You’re just automatically buying into the “racist” argument that people are claiming in this thread without thinking it through. I actually watched the cartoon series basically back to front and can see the direction M. Night and the production studio wanted to take this film (however shoddy I believe the writing and directing was). It’s VERY sad to see the reaction of some people to the movie who are eager to label the filmmakers as racist or doing “yellowface” when I see it as a complete attempt of multiculturalism. If the film was cast all Asian, do you think that would appeal to a diverse America? Or would it be cast off as being like one of those “foreign Asian movies” and then dismissed by the general public because of it? Are you forgetting that WHITE kids as well as black and Asian and Latino children watched and loved this cartoon series as well? The cartoon series itself was made BY Americans.
          Although I think the Last Airbender flunked because the CG effects and storyline adaptation sucked, it’s disappointing to me that if a future (Asian or non-Asian) director decides to film it with some white people in the main cast, people will go off left and right about racism without even thinking about it in the deeper context and how these characters apply to the movie. M. Night made a VERY good point about anime. He said that the facial features are designed to be (racially) ambiguous, and as a follower of anime for many years, I can attest to that. Anime has consistently borrowed “western” ideas or concepts and infused it with their own style, even making their characters have blue eyes and blond hair, and interestingly nobody complains. The Avatar series was INSPIRED by Asian-styled art and culture but there is no such mention of the characters actually being Asian. Their race was left to the audience’s imaginations. And for some white kids, they could imagine their heroes to be white, Asian children might see them in their mind’s eye as Asian, etc. – it differs with each person and I don’t blame M. Night for making his own interpretation. The cartoon series itself was given an “American style” to appeal to every kid in the US audience, and to differentiate itself from the English-dubbed anime that was coming out of Japan. Considering the diversity of the Avatar world that the creators designed, it would almost be silly to assume that every character or even most of them were racially Asian.

          Also, just because Avatar was influenced by the anime style that came from Japan, white people or non-Asians can’t appreciate or take part in it? Since when was anime or any cartoon style derivative of it reserved only for Asian people? Are white people not allowed to enjoy Mexican food? Is rap only inclusive towards black people? If you’re here at SB for the Kpop, then obviously not as some of the most popular idols in Asia are Korean rappers and directly imitate or are influenced by American music. There have even been discussions at SB about the scenario if Kpop were ever to become “big” in the US – since the hip hop/rap industry is mostly dominated by African Americans – would black rappers give them the same respect even if they’re Asian? Even Eminem had trouble breaking into rap because of his race. So you see, putting a “possessive attitude” toward any cultural product just results in creating barriers for other people to enjoy and understand your culture like you do. I have heard many, many times about expats living in Korea who speak fluently and are married to Korean partners, most likely committing to permanently staying and raising their family in Korea, and yet aren’t given the same “acceptance” that native Koreans give each other. Isolating yourselves and refusing to share your culture is a conscious decision, but it has consequences like anything else.

          • igbygrl

            ^ I don’t know why you are so angry. I just pointed out some white washings in movies and now you are accusing me for being ignorant?

            Where do you get off? What gives you the right for being so mean to me this way?

            Thank you for attacking me when I did no such thing to you!

            Next time I’ll just keep my opinions o myself because I guess some people wold rather go off in a tangent instead of debating their side in a calmer manner!

          • bd005

            The irony is that is that peachstem is the one who is ignorant.

            Asian-Americans out of all groups have the lowest self-esteem based on their race and the highest incidences of being bullied.

          • Mau_rice

            @igbygrl:disqus I don’t really get how the person was being mean, angry or attacking you. I just browsed through your conversation but point out the part where the writer called you ignorant, because I don’t see it.

            I just think you’re being too sensitive. Sheesh people.

            @bd005:disqus 

            “Asian-Americans out of all groups have the lowest self-esteem based on their race and the highest incidences of being bullied.”

            That’s a great way to stereotype Asians.

            From this thread I can see black people and other minorities who have the low “self-esteem” that you’re talking about.

            Maybe you can provide some EVIDENCE or statistics to support your claim? Or else it’s just all talk.

          • igbygrl

            Mau_rice if you actually read what I wrote and what Peachstem wrote he/she went on a tirade after I pointed out something. I think it’s uncalled for and you have no right to point this out to me since my feelings was the one that got hurt not yours!

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/XR2L6ZALLID5LP4B5DZFOQ3DXY Robert

            People like peachstem are the polished apologists for shameless AF sellouts. She’s highly skilled in making excuses for every instance of discriminatory / repugnant racebending Hollywood casting decisions that marginalize Asian people & our cultures. At the same time, she’ll have you believe that she is “fully” enlightened in race relationships (mainly white) & was not the least bit influenced by the pervasive white-run mainstream media ideals. The very “ideals” that continue to demonize & emasculate Asian males, sometimes overtly, other times, covertly, to the extent that AFs become so utterly brainwashed, they are riddled with self-loathing. When these AFs claim to be “free” to date outside the race, they really mean that males of the very race that her parents belong to, are not good enough for her to date & start a family with. Word of advice to such sellouts: AM-WF/WM-AF relationships, including marriages, seldom last. Not to mention, to the children of such unions, the Asian parent’s culture is normally lost due to parental low self-esteem. These children also tend to harbor negative views of their Asian heritage. After all, the proof is in the pudding – how many HAPAs (esp females) do you know of, have dated/married Asians? In Hollywood, the grand total for such couplings is 0.
            People like peachstem are pathetic because they are often delusional about their intrinsic value & position in white society at large, which did not go far beyond exoticism & hypersexualization by white men.

        • jesuis2

          More like films like “Balls of Fury” where Christopher Walken played Feng.

          And of course, the old Asian guy (played by James Hong) had the hot Asian daughter (Maqqie Q) while a Japanese actress had the role as the “Geisha.”

          And yeah, whenever there is any film or other project which calls for Asian male leads, the parts are almost inevitably cast for white actors (somehow, they manage to keep the female parts for AFs), meanwhile black actors are playing roles that were originally white.

          For instance, the La Jolla Playhouse presented the musical “The Nightingale”, which is set in ancient China.

          All the male parts, including that of the Emperor was filled by WM actors, while the female parts still went to AF actors.

          http://articles.latimes.com/2012/jul/19/entertainment/la-et-cm-asian-american-nightingale-la-jolla-playhouse-20120718

          If AM actors can’t even get parts in projects which are set in Asia, then when are they going to get work?

          Yeah, there have been a few parts, but that pales in comparison to AF actresses, much less roles of gays.

          Basically, your best shot at getting work is if you live up the the AM stereotype – which is why Gedde Watanabe aka Long Duk Dong used to get so much work and why Ken Jeong gets so much work today (note in “The Hangover” films where AMs are desexualized and AFs are hypersexualized – which is modus operandi for Hollywood).

          • igbygrl

            Yeah I totally agree…Movies like The Departed and 21 were completely white washed and doesn’t even reference the original movies which were from Asian countries.

          • http://profile.yahoo.com/XR2L6ZALLID5LP4B5DZFOQ3DXY Robert

            People like peachstem are the polished apologists for shameless AF sellouts. She’s highly skilled in making excuses for every instance of discriminatory / repugnant racebending Hollywood casting decisions that marginalize Asian people & our cultures. At the same time, she’ll have you believe that she is “fully” enlightened in race relationships (mainly white) & was not the least bit influenced by the pervasive white-run mainstream media ideals. The very “ideals” that continue to demonize & emasculate Asian males, sometimes overtly, other times, covertly, to the extent that AFs become so utterly brainwashed, they are riddled with self-loathing. When these AFs claim to be “free” to date outside the race, they really mean that males of the very race that her parents belong to, are not good enough for her to date & start a family with. Word of advice to such sellouts: AM-WF/WM-AF relationships & that includes marriages, seldom last. Not to mention, to the children of such unions, the Asian parent’s culture will be lost. These children also tend to harbor negative views of their Asian heritage. After all, the proof is in the pudding – how many HAPAs (esp females) do you know date/marry Asians? In Hollywood, the grand total for such couplings is 0.
            People like peachstem is pathetic because they are often delusional about their value & position in white society at large.

      • mangochic

        I love your whole post especially the following post,
        Psy wasn’t CONFORMING to any “Asian male” concept, his concept IS dancing and singing and looking funny, BOTH in Korea and in the US. In fact I APPLAUD his efforts in staying true to his personality and workmanship versus manufacturing himself to what Americans “stereotypically want”, like how many Kpop idols are trying to do now to break into the US. Psy was an artist and entertainer YEARS before William Hung ever stepped into the spotlight, and his concept has been consistent since the beginning. In fact, I’d argue that Psy’s popularity has rather to do with bringing something fresh and different to the American market rather than befitting “white people’s” stereotypes about Asians. Psy is rapping fluently in Korean rather than speaking English in an Asian accent. Can you please find me more examples OTHER than William Hung that embody the “singing/dancing Asian male” stereotype? The other examples you listed, at least to my knowledge, are acting roles rather than pop music culture figures and those two are vastly different categories. 

        I don’t know why people keep belittling all his work.

  • SamiSwanSion

    First of all, everything about the Tiger JK subject is absolute win. It’s definitely not racist, and I love how the author refuses to back down from that statement. Power to ya home girl, I’m right there with ya! Now on the subject of Psy. I felt bad about this situation until I realized that Psy’s kind of living the dream of the underdogs. He’s beaten out all the other pretty people in fame and fortune, by accomplishing their dreams before they could. Frankly, he and other un-pretty people trying to be entertainers in South Korea just get lumped into the category of “comedic value only.” Even the ones that attempt to breach idol status like Shindong, are still treated as kind of…well..subhuman to the Pretties. What else was a man of his stature to do in entertainment? What is he ALLOWED to do, rather? Be an idol? There are no Adele’s in the ranks of K-pop extraordinaires are there? He’s apart of the Uglies, and from what the K-sphere has taught me the Uglies are the MC’s, the hosts, the jesters to the gods and goddesses of the K-realm, and usually the humor displayed is pretty ripe with self-depreciation. So yay for Psy, he’s inadvertently turned the idea that the fat kid gets laughed at, on its head.

    Catch-22: unless something’s done soon he’ll become the Asian equivalent of the minstrels (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackface#Black_Minstrel_Shows) or at least the catalysts of such by consequentially helping to prepetrate this stereotype and nooo one wants that. He’s bringing out a much darker side over-brimming with micro-aggressions. Never in all my years of fandom have I seen Ellen talk DOWN to someone like that. Like a thing. Never. And I mean, someone should’ve explained to her that he KNOWS at least some English right? He handled it calmly though, with suave expertise. He reminds me of some of my actual IDOLS not just the k-pop variety, the ones who are used to not getting respect. And he makes his own, right there, and I love it. “No Mrs. Degeneres, I have class, the only thing campy is my dance” is what was said in between the lines, in my opinion. So I think him standing up for himself and for other Asian acts will be the key factor in keeping stupidity at bay.

  • http://twitter.com/silverukiss Silver

    regardless of whether you classify it as racism or not, what he did was wrong. Not only is it wrong to lump all people into one group simply because of how they look, but it was highly unprofessional. He was paid to perform at that concert, so he should have sung his songs, not gone into a tirade and then screamed for 10 mins. As the paid professional he should have taken the higher ground, and then those boys should have been kicked out of the concert and not be allowed to return.

    It is never alright to discriminate against people because of their skin color, no matter who it’s coming from. Is it alright for different colored people to call Caucasians “white trash” simply because Caucasians (supposedly) hold more power? Isn’t that a little presumptuous to assume that because someone is white they hold more power than a person of different colored skin? I think China and Japan would argue against that.

    Coming from a bi-cultural family I once told my friends that I was incapable of being racist, because I would have to hate my own family. I have since rethought that. I believe that anyone is capable of acting racist against anyone who looks different then them.

    • http://profile.yahoo.com/MMRQEZEPSNJ26LJ7XJNDDM5NCI JasmineA

      See that’s the problem people don’t know what racism is. No its not alright to call Caucasians “white trash” simply because they hold more power, but that’s not racism that is being prejudice. No one said that being prejudice (name-calling, violence because of stereotypes about a race) was okay, people are saying that white people cannot experience racism a system in which the dominate race holds the power to oppress another race (job discrimination, unfair laws etc) because minorities do not have enough people in power to have that affect over white people. So when someone says white cannot experience racism, they are not saying its okay to be prejudice against whites, they are saying there are another enough minorities in high positions to affect whites on a bigger scale. 

      • http://twitter.com/silverukiss Silver

         I understand what other people are saying, but that’s where we are going to have to agree to disagree. To me being racist when used by the general populace does not imply that definition, but rather something closer to the definition of being prejudiced. As to whether your definition or my definition is right, I don’t know, and I’m not sure it really matters in the larger scheme of things.

  • TonyKoo

    Hey, I’m an Asian guy, and I love what Psy is doing for us. The fact is, there are a lot of people in the world right now that are scared of Asian people (and from that, we know resentment and even hatred starts). Psy makes the world a little bit less afraid of us and it makes us a little bit more acceptable. Are people laughing at him? No. We’re laughing WITH him. Otherwise, people wouldn’t be following him so much right now by doing so many parodies of him. If he were a laughing stock, people would just point and laugh, not actually follow what he’s doing.

    Psy is cool. He’s able to make uncool be cool, and that, people, is something special.
    Here’s a blog I wrote about why Gangnam Style is so popular.http://tonykoo.com/?p=8

    • jesuis2

      Yeah, like people didn’t mimick William Hung and the whole “shebang” thing, not to mention Long Duk Dong from “Sixteen Candles.”

  • http://twitter.com/Hyorinshiro SS501

    I totally agree with JK cuz really the ignorance is so stupid. I have it happen to me almost every time I first meet someone. I’m originially from England but my skin color is not white and my parents are from Africa and their skin color is not black but when I first tell them that, they give me weird looks and ask me if I’m Indian…… I don’t think people have had geography lesson or understand race/ethnicity and nationality. I happen to be Asian, yes but I am not Indian. India is a country and since I was born in England and hold citizenship there and neither of my parents hold citizenship in India kinda means I’m not indian… why the f**k am I being called Indian? Some people even ask me if I’m really from England or if my parents are black? Those are the ignorant bastards that forget that skin color does not tell what country you are born in. I dare anyperson to f**king ask me one more time if I’m f**king Indian, lets see what your face looks like afterwards

  • lilibaiyu

    The blogger writes “I salute you”  — Oh, me too. It was an emotional response, sure, but who says they can’t understand where JK was coming from? I understand perfectly. This is a frustrating little period of time where back home in Korea they’re all doing the happy dance at the big entertainment companies because they think the floodgates have now been opened by Psy and all of their K-Pop acts can now finally begin streaming into the US market in earnest. Well, I disagree. Psy is a novelty act, his song is a novelty song. It’s a one-off. All the ugly stereotypes that Asians have to deal with will come skulking back into the picture as soon as the Psy bubble bursts. And it’s frustrating as hell. Personally, I’m putting my hopes on US producers like Bruce “Automatic” Vanderveer who produced the brilliant song “Uncommitted” for JYJ’s Junsu recently. It’s a serious entry into the hip hop world and singing in English, Junsu does a world class vocal on it. We need more of the likes of Junsu and a hell of a lot less of Psy in the future, in my humble opinion. All the great Asian artists there are out there don’t ever deserve to be laughed at.

    • mangochic

       “We need more of the likes of Junsu and a hell of a lot less of Psy in the future, in my humble opinion” Why? It seems like you are belittling Psy and his talent.

      • lilibaiyu

        Just my own personal taste of course but I don’t like novelty songs by novelty acts. Junsu is more my kind of artist. He’s a great singer, a really talented songwriter, a fantastic dancer and he’s beautiful to look at. He’s the whole package, he’s got it all goin’ on. 

    • http://www.facebook.com/chibijoshie Josh Chinnery

      These K-Pop idols work too hard to be laughed at and ridiculed. Whenever I have a complaint about something, I usually start ranting about their agency; they hold the power, not the idols themselves.

  • http://twitter.com/like_thewater Ciara

    I appreciate this post so much. As an African-American who has dealt with racism before, I too agree that Tiger JK wasn’t in the wrong. Some say maybe he shouldn’t have went off at that moment, but if not then, when? When are people going to get it? When are they going to realize that not every person in a certain minority represents another person (I hope that made sense!)? It’s great that Korean music, more specifically K-Pop, is getting more recognition, but it can be so annoying when people want to lump all of the artists together and have them represent that one “culture” as a whole. Just like American music, there are many other genres of Korean music. I hope that in the future people, especially American fans such as myself and fans of other countries be more mindful of not only their comments but the way that they treat artists and citizens of a certain background.

    • http://twitter.com/silverukiss Silver

       I know isn’t it annoying and degrading when people group all artists into one category because they don’t understand the other culture? We all know that American artists are sassy sluts exactly like Lady Gaga, but if they would just take the time to understand the other culture, they could see that Korean culture is not Psy.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/XR2L6ZALLID5LP4B5DZFOQ3DXY Robert

    Bravo. I applaud your article. It underscores a very vexatious issue that many “progressive, politically-correct” (simply white MSM-brainwashed) Asians either refuse or fail to comprehend. After reading some delusional posts here by several white status-quo supporting Asian apologists, I begin wonder if these folks are suffering from Stockholm Syndrome. The viability of being “racist” to the empowered oppressor race, whose colonial escapades, have so thoroughly enriched its descendants to the continuing detriment of non-whites & their lands, was rich if not absolutely ridiculous. Racism is an artifice used by whites during the colonial times to steal from, rape & kill non-whites in the name of “the white men’s burden”. Until we Asians are able to project such global oppression along racial lines & to supplant the current status quo, we CANNOT be racists, in behavior or thoughts.

    • http://twitter.com/silverukiss Silver

       Glad to know you care so much about what my ancestors did, and think that it should define what I am or am not capable of doing now, based on my skin color.

      Sarcasm aside though, in my experience this is what gets the majority of “whites” (a completely nondescriptive term, considering this means you could come from a large amount of nationalities, including South Africa) get upset about when it comes to treating a person differently because of their skin color: the implication that because of what our ancestors did in ancient history, we are the only ones capable of being racist and so should willingly take any all crap that is thrown our way. Because it comes from non-whites it obviously cannot be racism. You back anyone into a corner simply because of their skin color and they are going to lash out, no matter if they are white, black, yellow, purple, whatever.

      I for one, could give a rat’s ass what my “ancestors” did. The only thing I care about is how I treat people here and now. I’m not particularly the type of person to dwell in the past, or to put the past before the present.

  • plushiesexual

    Dude, you and Tiger JK are my hero.
    I have nothing else more to say.

  • Wooju Lee

    a rather over-written article, but i get your point.

  • 3MKMK

    Amy

  • 3MKMK

    Now let’s call a spade a spade, not a big spoon. Tiger JK was clearly racist, without a
    doubt. Can I sit here and say he was wrong in speaking against what they did? HELL NO.. however, he should have ranted against the culprits.Blame the culprits, not the whole race….. He should have blamed/ranted at the people who heckled him as opposed to bringing in the whole race. Personally, I am all for him expressing himself, when someone does you wrong, you call those particular people out, not the race. I absolutely LOVED his apology, as he clearly explained , at least that is how I interpreted it that his rant was on the culprits, not the whole race. The actions of a few individuals do not represent a whole race, just because they are some loud black women does not mean all black women are like that, just because there are some nerds who happen to be Asians does not mean all Asians are smart and nerdy…..Always look at an individual, not a race….

    Your definition of racism – Prejudice plus power “If you do not have the power — granted to you systematically through various institutions normalized by your society — to purposefully oppress another race, you cannot be racist.”

    I am from Africa and I have met AFRICANS that are out right racist towards Asians.. calling them ching chong, how they all look the same, brainiacks, copy cats, the gay or funny friend, all asia is either china or japan etc…..… you name it all. Now, countries from Africa have no power ( at least not the power as defined by you ) does that mean they are not racist as opposed to when a white person does it?  Vice versa as well, I have met Asians who are racist against black people and dare I say, SOME  individuals in Korea have been described as racist by people who have been to the country …… does that mean those individuals in Korea are not racist because they don’t have the power you have defined.

    Racism comes in all forms, shapes and sizes. Blacks, Asians, Whites, Bi-racials, Multi-racials..all can be racist judging upon their actions not the power they have. It has nothing to do with the person having power to be termed as racist. I am emphatic towards people that have experienced racism as Tiger JK, and his wife ( who by the way has said she has experienced hardships from both ends the western and Asian side because of her race) as it is not funny and does affect you in a lot of ways. That is why  I do admire Tiger JK for admitting at least what I think was wrong, apologizing for it, BUT still explaining that what the culprits did was wrong and that they shouldn’t have done that.

  • 7cinta

    I haven’t been on this site in forever but I logged in just to thank you for writing this article. It was very eloquent and very much needed to be said.

  • http://twitter.com/nicolewonton Nicole Won

    This article is so well written and touches upon the most important aspect of racism towards Asians (and how it is  being highlighted now more than ever with the PSY craze). Its really great how learned and intelligent you are on these issues such as “there is no such thing as reverse racism” and how you highlight that Tiger JK reacted to the systematic racism that he has probably been facing all his entire life. 

    It’s so interesting to see Asians appearing more and more into our pop culture, because you’re right–up to this point they have been used as comic relief or a sidekick friend with really “wacky” cultural habits. There is never an Asian lead or rarely an Asian character that is devoid of stereotypes. At first as a Korean American, I was proud of PSY fame, because I found it amazing that people were really into him without even knowing what he was singing. I also think the basis of his song is authentically Korean pop, so it was nice to see that being represented. However, this new fame also does stem from being more a caricature. I don’t know if him being asian contributes to the caricature, but people are obviously gangnam style to the list of existing stereotypes.I also heard about Ellen, which made me annoyed, but hearing about what Chelsea did, further appalls me. It further goes to show that racism towards model minority is often brushed off as a “joke” in this society, and Asian are not supposed to take it personally or be offended. To me that is the most frustrating, because it makes the discrimination seem trivial, when in fact it is potent and detrimental.  

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/AMA2622O4UW32Z7JJAXJNENAWQ Dasdasd

    Mongol Empire conquered Eastern Europe and wiped out 1/3 of European population.

    I agree with Tiger JK what he said is absolutely correct, nothing new under the sun. Their depictions against Asians is nothing new, they have no respect for minorities. U.S is a bullshit country which claims equality and human rights but are so bias to Muslims and Asians.  Look at their bullshit hollywood movies, it’s always filled with exaggerated b.s

  • koraus

    Thank you. I could not have
    said it better myself.

     

    A lot of white people have
    no idea. For example, once, I was saying to a white guy about how I always get
    people pronouncing my last name wrong… even when it’s part of the English
    vocabulary… SONG…  although its not how Koreans pronounce it I would
    prefer they read it as it is spelled.  Instead, they’ll pronounce it
    Soong. Like Wtf? Can you not read your own language? And this white guy says to
    me as if it’s a given… “Yeah, it’s because we want to be respectful”….OMG They
    have no clue… They don’t see that making up their own pronunciation of names in
    what they think is ‘ASIAN’-like” is racist. On top of that, they are assuming
    ALL asians pronounce things the same way. So f*cking ignorant…

     

    Good on Tiger JK. Although
    it was racist to generalize and I know not all white people are racist.. but it
    needed to be said (and look, its not just white people, I’ve had middle
    eastern, European, other Asians use this subtle  kind of indirect
    racism on me. Its worse than blatant racism because others don’t notice it) 

     

    There was this one time
    this chinese-indonesian guy said to his friends right infront of me that
    Japanese people are better than Koreans, and I knew this guy, we were all on a
    holiday together. It was said with intentions to offend and to make me feel
    left out. Other Asians have said or hinted that Japanese are better than
    Koreans to me before also. Another time this chinese girl was saying she went
    to Korea and it smelled and she was surprised and was saying they joked with
    her friends who also know me that I had a generic face and everyone looked like
    me in Korea…its like shes never been to Chinatown (was that racist?)and it
    looked like she got herself some double eye lids too, and she had the nerve to
    comment on my apprearance and the place I have no connection to really other
    than the fact I was born there and left when I was 2. Asians who are racist
    against other asians who live in the same country and experience the same sh*t
    are so unbelievably confused and are the worst.

     

    If you’re not a minority in
    a white country, or in a multicultural society, who deals with this kind of
    racism daily…. Yes, daily… I am not exaggerating…. It would be hard to understand,
    but this sh*t happens, and it’s swept under the rug too easy. And when you speak
    out  on the spot in response, you are usually seen to be
    ‘over-reacting’.

     

    There are also sadly, some
    white-washed Asians , when speaking of other Asians, who clump all Asians in
    the same category as well, as if it makes them more accepted by white
    people.  The kind of white people described above, are the type who
    would say to their other white friends, “oh it’s okay, he’s/she’s cool.
    He/She’s not like the other Asians. He’s/She’s a cool Asian”… And those
    white washed have no idea how racist that is.

     

    Silver, If Tiger JK had handled it ‘professionally’ we probably wouldn’t be discussing such an important issue right now.  When did a change ever occur, doing things professionally? What would just quietly kicking them out have done? The racists would never have got the message, although I doubt they would have either way. Nevertheless, the crowd needed to hear that they shouldn’t do that sh*t anywhere else either.
     
    Do you know how hard it is to take that ‘Higher ground” you speak of, in such a position? And taking the ‘Higher ground’ only works to your benefit when those people who are being racist towards you know they are being racist. How would ignorant people know they are being ignorant, unless they are told. Even then, the chances are slim. But more people need to know that those people who say those things aren’t going to get away with it.
     
    But I do agree with you that it is still racism if say a black person is racist to white person, vice versa. What do you called it when Asians are racists to Asians? Whos superior? E.g. Chinese or Korean, Indo-chinese or Korean? What happens when they are of mixed race? It’s racism, anyway.
     
    Anyway, what Tiger JK said needed to be said, minus the ‘f all the white ppl’ thing. I’m sure he would’ve named the culprits if he knew their names. But he did say f everyone who thinks he should dance and make everyone laugh..- that’s not just white people.
     
    Australia has been my home for over 20 years. Its generally a nice place to live but this is the crap you have to deal with daily and I assume it isn’t any better in the US or England or wherever.

    Longest post I’ve ever written lol… but I think it needed to be said!

    • shnickers

       I feel for you – I live in the U.S. and I’m happy to say that I’m NOT discriminated against on a daily basis (and I live in Arizona, home to the most ridiculous immigration laws EVER). You might argue that I’m ignorant to the “obvious.” But when you’re looking for racism, you can’t help but find it, can you?

      Let’s keep in mind that not all ignorant comments are racist – racism involves categorizing a group as being inferior OR superior based on one characterization and/or a hate component. Though I don’t believe in personal anecdotes as empirical evidence, I’ll share a story about an older white male who rode next to me on a plane. In the typical sequence, he introduced himself and in the next two or three exchanges, asked the ever-looming question: “Where are you from?” I happen to extremely hate this comment, but love playing around with people’s expectations. “Well… not from America.” I can see him gearing up to ask the obvious follow-up question, but I quickly jump in, “At least not until Texas secedes from the United States!” Stymied, he asks where my parents are from – “Korea.” Thankfully, he knows the difference between the Koreas, so all he says next is, “Well, I really like kimchi!” …Okay, good for you! Yes, these types of conversations are annoying, and maybe a bit discriminatory for automatically assuming I’m born in another country based on my appearance. But they aren’t racist – he’s not saying or implying I’m inferior based on the assumptions he’s making. So I tell him how for me personally it’s a little annoying when people assume I’m from another country because I’m not white. There’s an awkward moment where he apologizes and I write it off, but I’d like to think my explanation made a difference in the way he acted. Most people aren’t out to make you feel like crap, but unfortunately it happens once in a while.

      Another situation – I had just met a guy in college who was an adopted Korean and was only starting to learn more about the Korean culture. He assumes I’m anti-Japanese and goes off on a totally racist rant about all of the Japanese people he’s met. The height of his claim is, “We have to follow our grandfathers!” Unfortunately for him, I was majoring in Japanese and when I told him how not all Japanese people were horrid, he wouldn’t buy it at all. So yeah, you can be annoyed and offended by all kinds of people. Did I let him make me believe that all Koreans or adopted Koreans were horrific based on one bad experience? No.

      So maybe I can’t totally empathize with all of your comments – especially the one about “whitewashed” Asians, which I personally find EXTREMELY discriminatory. Maybe the Asians you’ve met don’t have tact, but as someone who’s been often categorized as “whitewashed” I don’t see how it’s any less discriminatory than labeling someone FOB (that’s “fresh off the boat,” for those of you not in the know).

      But I think you’re missing the point of this (extremely misguided) article. The writer is saying black people and other minorities CANNOT be racist towards white people in a white-majority society. Doesn’t matter how intense or severe their comments or actions are. Because they have no “power” in their society, they (and we, be default) can say and do whatever the hell we want! It’s *only* discriminatory. No biggie, right?

      However, this happy little theory fails to realize that in this situation, Tiger JK has more power than those stupid concertgoers – the writer asks, “Where’s their apology?!?!” while failing to realize, hello! These people most likely aren’t famous or well-known – even if they did apologize, who the hell would know? They don’t have the reach of Tiger JK. I think it’s awesome that as an advocate for racism, he can recognize his own behavior and have the balls to apologize for it. What’s important to realize is the controversy isn’t against him speaking out, but in his comment that linked those dumbasses with ALL white people. As someone who’s probably experienced a lot of hate in both America AND South Korea, I don’t think it was good for him to go off on a rant like that. It kind of defeats the purpose of his efforts.

      Is it any better when Chelsea Handler says something racist as compared
      to a comedian like Aziz Ansari or Chis Rock? This article writer says
      yes, because Chelsea is in a more prominent position than either Aziz or
      Chris. Yet, do her words hurt any less? I don’t think so.

      I think it’s good to point out discriminatory behavior, but you can’t use a few encounters to generalize to one group as a whole – that, in essence, is discriminatory behavior. And without a prejudicial component – where you’re saying that an entire group of people is inferior OR superior – there technically isn’t racism. Does that mean it hurts or offends any less? No. But instead of passive aggressively complaining or bitching to one another, let’s try telling the offensive person exactly why their comment is discriminatory or racist. For those of you who believe some knowledge is world-wide – I do admit feeling scared for future generations when people mix up North and South Korea, for example – not everything you take for granted is common knowledge. Do you guys know every cultural norm outside your own? Keep that in mind when dealing with so-called ignorant fools. A little knowledge goes a long way, people.

      And is racism only apparent in white-majority societies? Of course not. I lived and worked in Korea and was extremely appalled by some of the things students, teachers, and random civilians said and believed. Like how Chinese people are “dirty” because they never wash their hands, how every black male is Obama, south-east Asians and black people are a lower-caste, and don’t even get me started on Japanese people. One of the teachers I know confessed to being afraid of having to work with a black person when she learned the incoming English teacher was South African. I kind of stared at her. But then I realized that practically the only exposure to black people in South Korea are military men or the violent drug cartel and gang characters you see in the movies. The only black military men I ran into happened to be drunk, horny and grabby (I’ve only seen them in bars). So yeah, it’s racist, but I can see where she might get her fears from. So instead of chiding her and making her feel like crap, I told her that not every black person is like that, just like how you can’t judge every Korean the same way.

      Yikes, this reply is going on way longer than anticipated. I’m not trying to say that your experiences should be written off. You have every right to be angry at THOSE people. Maybe I would be angrier if those same comments were directed at me. But we have to fight ignorance (which is the basis of the majority of discriminatory comments) with knowledge if we want to make a difference.

    • shnickers

       I feel for you – I live in the U.S. and I’m happy to say that I’m NOT discriminated against on a daily basis (and I live in Arizona, home to the most ridiculous immigration laws EVER). You might argue that I’m ignorant to the “obvious.” But when you’re looking for racism, you can’t help but find it, can you?

      Let’s keep in mind that not all ignorant comments are racist – racism involves categorizing a group as being inferior OR superior based on one characterization and/or a hate component. Though I don’t believe in personal anecdotes as empirical evidence, I’ll share a story about an older white male who rode next to me on a plane. In the typical sequence, he introduced himself and in the next two or three exchanges, asked the ever-looming question: “Where are you from?” I happen to extremely hate this comment, but love playing around with people’s expectations. “Well… not from America.” I can see him gearing up to ask the obvious follow-up question, but I quickly jump in, “At least not until Texas secedes from the United States!” Stymied, he asks where my parents are from – “Korea.” Thankfully, he knows the difference between the Koreas, so all he says next is, “Well, I really like kimchi!” …Okay, good for you! Yes, these types of conversations are annoying, and maybe a bit discriminatory for automatically assuming I’m born in another country based on my appearance. But they aren’t racist – he’s not saying or implying I’m inferior based on the assumptions he’s making. So I tell him how for me personally it’s a little annoying when people assume I’m from another country because I’m not white. There’s an awkward moment where he apologizes and I write it off, but I’d like to think my explanation made a difference in the way he acted. Most people aren’t out to make you feel like crap, but unfortunately it happens once in a while.

      Another situation – I had just met a guy in college who was an adopted Korean and was only starting to learn more about the Korean culture. He assumes I’m anti-Japanese and goes off on a totally racist rant about all of the Japanese people he’s met. The height of his claim is, “We have to follow our grandfathers!” Unfortunately for him, I was majoring in Japanese and when I told him how not all Japanese people were horrid, he wouldn’t buy it at all. So yeah, you can be annoyed and offended by all kinds of people. Did I let him make me believe that all Koreans or adopted Koreans were horrific based on one bad experience? No.

      So maybe I can’t totally empathize with all of your comments – especially the one about “whitewashed” Asians, which I personally find EXTREMELY discriminatory. Maybe the Asians you’ve met don’t have tact, but as someone who’s been often categorized as “whitewashed” I don’t see how it’s any less discriminatory than labeling someone FOB (that’s “fresh off the boat,” for those of you not in the know).

      But I think you’re missing the point of this (extremely misguided) article. The writer is saying black people and other minorities CANNOT be racist towards white people in a white-majority society. Doesn’t matter how intense or severe their comments or actions are. Because they have no “power” in their society, they (and we, be default) can say and do whatever the hell we want! It’s *only* discriminatory. No biggie, right?

      However, this happy little theory fails to realize that in this situation, Tiger JK has more power than those stupid concertgoers – the writer asks, “Where’s their apology?!?!” while failing to realize, hello! These people most likely aren’t famous or well-known – even if they did apologize, who the hell would know? They don’t have the reach of Tiger JK. I think it’s awesome that as an advocate for racism, he can recognize his own behavior and have the balls to apologize for it. What’s important to realize is the controversy isn’t against him speaking out, but in his comment that linked those dumbasses with ALL white people. As someone who’s probably experienced a lot of hate in both America AND South Korea, I don’t think it was good for him to go off on a rant like that. It kind of defeats the purpose of his efforts.

      Is it any better when Chelsea Handler says something racist as compared
      to a comedian like Aziz Ansari or Chis Rock? This article writer says
      yes, because Chelsea is in a more prominent position than either Aziz or
      Chris. Yet, do her words hurt any less? I don’t think so.

      I think it’s good to point out discriminatory behavior, but you can’t use a few encounters to generalize to one group as a whole – that, in essence, is discriminatory behavior. And without a prejudicial component – where you’re saying that an entire group of people is inferior OR superior – there technically isn’t racism. Does that mean it hurts or offends any less? No. But instead of passive aggressively complaining or bitching to one another, let’s try telling the offensive person exactly why their comment is discriminatory or racist. For those of you who believe some knowledge is world-wide – I do admit feeling scared for future generations when people mix up North and South Korea, for example – not everything you take for granted is common knowledge. Do you guys know every cultural norm outside your own? Keep that in mind when dealing with so-called ignorant fools. A little knowledge goes a long way, people.

      And is racism only apparent in white-majority societies? Of course not. I lived and worked in Korea and was extremely appalled by some of the things students, teachers, and random civilians said and believed. Like how Chinese people are “dirty” because they never wash their hands, how every black male is Obama, south-east Asians and black people are a lower-caste, and don’t even get me started on Japanese people. One of the teachers I know confessed to being afraid of having to work with a black person when she learned the incoming English teacher was South African. I kind of stared at her. But then I realized that practically the only exposure to black people in South Korea are military men or the violent drug cartel and gang characters you see in the movies. The only black military men I ran into happened to be drunk, horny and grabby (I’ve only seen them in bars). So yeah, it’s racist, but I can see where she might get her fears from. So instead of chiding her and making her feel like crap, I told her that not every black person is like that, just like how you can’t judge every Korean the same way.

      Yikes, this reply is going on way longer than anticipated. I’m not trying to say that your experiences should be written off. You have every right to be angry at THOSE people. Maybe I would be angrier if those same comments were directed at me. But we have to fight ignorance (which is the basis of the majority of discriminatory comments) with knowledge if we want to make a difference.

  • http://twitter.com/specialkpop SpecialKpop

    Agree with this article 100%, and the points were so eloquently put forward.

  • http://twitter.com/specialkpop SpecialKpop

    Agree with this article 100%, and the points were so eloquently put forward.

  • http://www.facebook.com/janne.doe.7543 Janne Doe

    Psy is getting what he deserves. He’s so busy  trying to ride that gravy train he’s allowing himself to be used as the stereotypical tool. If he was concerned with his image and respect he’d demand actual interviews and to be taken seriously. He’s no different from Soulja Boi or LMFAO. I have mad respect for Tiger JK. People like him help hold the game up and give us something that’s real and not just a gimmick.

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/DMDPOWEVDGS5PSD5YOFVCCXEGQ James

    While I agree with some that it is racist to make judgements upon a group based on color, skin, laguange, sex, etc., but in this case where rage and complex emotions can clouds ones speech, I can not hold PK accountable for his remarks. Racism hurts on the receivers’ end coming from whomever. However growing up Asian American, I find it extremely difficult to tolerate racism when it comes from people of Anglo-decent. Its tough enough to hear it through the US media that is run, managed and owned by mostly ‘whites’, and even more difficult to hear it in person when it is directed towards me.

    PK, you did what I wanted to do for a very long time and that is scream and yell, letting out  feelings and frustrations at the media and people that has treated and portrayed the Asian man as their comedic prop. You had every right to say it in my book. Even though it was not politically correct, you were able to shed light on the emotions and feelings of myself and probably whole lot of other Asian men. Thank you for standing up.

    -James

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/DMDPOWEVDGS5PSD5YOFVCCXEGQ James

    While I agree with some that it is racist to make judgements upon a group based on color, skin, laguange, sex, etc., but in this case where rage and complex emotions can clouds ones speech, I can not hold PK accountable for his remarks. Racism hurts on the receivers’ end coming from whomever. However growing up Asian American, I find it extremely difficult to tolerate racism when it comes from people of Anglo-decent. Its tough enough to hear it through the US media that is run, managed and owned by mostly ‘whites’, and even more difficult to hear it in person when it is directed towards me.

    PK, you did what I wanted to do for a very long time and that is scream and yell, letting out  feelings and frustrations at the media and people that has treated and portrayed the Asian man as their comedic prop. You had every right to say it in my book. Even though it was not politically correct, you were able to shed light on the emotions and feelings of myself and probably whole lot of other Asian men. Thank you for standing up.

    -James

  • http://www.facebook.com/chibijoshie Josh Chinnery

    I think that Tiger JK wasn’t necessarily in the wrong for his comment, but he definitely wasn’t in the right for cussing out the entire Caucasian race. As for his apology, I think it was beautiful; the man sat back and thought about what he said and realized that the way he expressed his frustration at this event was not right. Was his frustration justified? YES!!!! Racism is a terrible terrible thing and I have only experienced verbal racism, but it still hits hard. To be thought of as less of a person just because I have dark hair, dark eyes, and dark skin is heartbreaking. I also disagree with your definition of racism. Regardless of your racial status, you can be racist; even to your own race!! I know some of y’all are looking at me like I’m crazy, but it’s happened to me. I’ve been several times that I don’t act black enough (read – my demeanor is not “hood” enough) or that I talk like a walk person (read – I don’t use a lot of hood slang) by other black people; it makes me nuts. My heart goes out for Tiger and his family; this racism business is not cool.

  • Deemy

    Great article! I agree 100%.

  • uarebabo

    This is an old topic, but i just came across this site. Sorry but it isn’t technically reverse racism. By your definition Tiger JK has more power than the “White Hecklers” in this scenario because the concert was in SOUTH KOREA. White people are a minority in South Korea, Tiger JK WAS BEING RACIST! :)

    • AlRussell

      Then they should have had some damn sense and been respectful of the man in his own house. His venue, his house. They got what they deserved and, while I too wish Tiger JK’d chosen different language, I fully respect his position.

  • New York City

    Word is Bond Tiger JK. I feel him deeply, I really do. Even Koreans from Korea that move later in life have racial problems with Korean Americans and how they live. We Korean Americans already have enough racial discrimination to deal with in America and we have to hear it from our own people from Korea also???? More people need to speak out like Tiger JK, or else we Koreans are gonna suffer another decade of being labeled as PSY to everyone. I know I hate to say this, but PSY success is not in the greater good of the longevity of Koreans globally.

  • http://twitter.com/sisiberlyn Sierra Bell

    I’d just like to tackle everything here in one go.

    First of all, Tiger JK, while he should not have handled it that way and definitely
    should have handled the situation with more grace (not only is it the
    right thing to do for anyone, but it also makes him look even better
    anyway), I can understand him snapping. I can only imagine how much
    garbage the man has been put through over his marriage, his son, and his
    own ethnicity. I have heard stories about people calling his son the
    N-word, as if it isn’t bad enough that someone would say that about an ADULT, what kind of perversion of character does it take to say that about a CHILD? And now on top of all that, we got PSY just feeding into the “goofy Asian” stereotype. Granted, PSY is a very funny guy, naturally. But he’s only seen as just a “funny guy” in South Korea or other parts of Asia. In America, he’s a “funny ASIAN.” That’s all people see. Now the repercussions of that include other Asian people being harassed to do goofy, ridiculous things bc “Hey, that Asian guy on TV did it, they must ALL like it, right??” Now Tiger JK, during HIS OWN SONG, gets told to stop and do Gangnam Style. I’m sorry, but that was RUDE. RUDE RUDE RUDE. The man is there performing his own material for you but all you want is Gangnam Style? Because being silly is all Asian people can do, right? No, they can’t write real, thought provoking music, right? Please.

    This rant was a long time coming, and yes, he could have been more mature, but likely he wasn’t in his right mind. I won’t try to rationalize the hateful things he said, because it was wrong, but I won’t take it personally because everyone has those times where we just can’t take anymore and we wind up saying things we don’t mean. I can only pray he will turn to Jesus and forgive those kids and that those boys will learn some respect for their fellow human beings.

  • vipa567

    “The definition of racism is prejudice plus power” So by going by this equation only white people can be racist? What a load of crap, JK was being racist. As for Psy – were you expecting people to respect him as an artist? he’s getting what he deserves nothing more nothing less.

  • Figgie

    EAST ASIANS: Most racist/homogenous people on earth. And no, they ARE NOT a true minority. they are often more elitist than some caucasians, often socioeconomically above ethnic whites. East Asians, I mean. Being an ethnic caucasian, with a very ethnic, long Italian last name and growing up in an elitist suburb of NYC, I can tell you that Whites (and I don’t mean ethnic whites, I mean wasps, wealthy jews) AND EAST Asians live in the same neighborhoods and are equally pretentious, elitist, racist. East Asians are not even close to being a minority. In fact, I’m treated as more of a minority then they are. Yes, they are often treated better than some people of european descent. Elitist, racist people are the whitey whites and east asians specifically. Blacks are the true minority and are used as scapegoats, often treated like dirt, yet most blacks are better and more humane than any white or asian person. So yeah, EAST Asians are NOT NOT NOT a MINORITY. If you are going to tell me this is not true, then you are in total DENIAL. You notice I said EAST? Yes, because India (and other similar south asian countries) are not as eilitist as eastern neighbors. Just like Europeans stole from others, remember Buddhism came from India. I’m going to write a book about this. I know the truth can hurt. This IS the TRUTH.

    • AlRussell

      Someday you’re going to choke on your bitter, bigoted spittle.

  • indielokimin

    Tiger JK had every right to be angry. Any other Korean or Asian on that stage would’ve reacted the same. It might not have been an appropriate reaction, but it was totally warranted. Those fuckers had it coming.

  • AlRussell

    Man, I love Tiger JK and I’m just sorry that he has ever had to endure such douchebags. As a white woman, I’m as appalled by this kind of racist BS as anyone could be. It taints the image of Caucasians everywhere when so many of us behave like insensitive asshats. Unfortunately, there are far, far too many ignorant tools in America. I have to encounter them every day in the rural area where I live. People around here always try to tell me that this or that neighbor is actually really nice, but I’ve heard what they say about others. Even if they are decent to ME because I look like them, I find it impossible to set aside the fact that their attitudes would do a 180 if my skin were a few shades darker. I wish that someday Americans would grow up and stop with all the self aggrandizing. We’re not all that.

  • Doge Wallace

    I had to deal with two racist white assholes at the K-Town Market in Los Angeles last night. They insulted several food vendors there, laughing the whole time. I guess if something isn’t steak and potatoes, it’s exotic and must be made fun of, including the people who sell those food items. Then to top it off, they made a sexist and misogynistic remark to a female business owner and then walked away, laughing.

  • ; ^ }

    As somebody that’s white, I can assure you that I won’t hate you for your skin colour, I’ll hate you for you.
    The problem with verbal racism is that people focus on the specific words, when they should be focusing on how they’re used. If somebody is being ‘racist’ towards you in a non-physical way, then they’re just being a dick. I think that there should be seperate definitions for the word ‘racist’. One definition is the true definition, but only to the point where it’s racism beyond words, and is taken to the level of segregation, exclusion, violence, etc., while the other definition should be listed as a synonym for ‘douche’.

    Who fucking cares what others think? I mean, sure, when my dad came to Canada from Italy back in the last 60’s (Parents were still sour from the invasion of Sicily, as many Canadians fought there), he grew up being called a wop, and he resorted to violence more often than he should have, but I think he shouldn’t have beaten them up for calling him a wop, but for them being dicks towards him.

    If everybody just starts hating people for who they are, the world would be a much better place.

    ^
    How does that sound?

  • Brian McNally

    I like the article and makes an important point. Also, I don’t expect people to be wrongly offended, then get angry like Mary Poppins or Sailor Moon.

    BUT – “Hey Honkey” online is nothing compared to what Eminem faced in school – getting bullied and beat up all the time by black kids. That experience is now quite common, which part of why Eminem strikes a chord. YES, power plus prejudice equals racism/power to discriminate, but white people don’t always control the board these days. For example, predominently black, asian, or latino neighborhoods in multiracial america run their own affairs as they like them, thank you very much. Also for example, KOREA. also for example JAPAN. If Asian Americans sound more under seige and defensive than Koreans, Chinese and Japanese, that is becasue they are not the predominant race/culture. Children feel which race and culture rules the board in a very real, personal way. It stays with you. Its why some men in the ghetto strut in a way African men do not. After that experience, I would have … been pissed for some very real reasons. Disrespect is Disrespect, period.

    If an innocent white man in Korea, Japan, or China is profiled as a foreigner, therefore automatically judged guilty of criminal activity, can we call this reverse racism or racism of Northeast Asia? This happened to me. Lefty Racial PC Semanitic types fo the USA can never understand this example, because they fail to understand why we are talking about other nations (ethnocentrism, USA USA USA). Our racial vocabulary was created by White Affluent University People, who are mostly Monocultural and Monolingual. This is almost completely useless to the Mondern, Internet, Multiracial and Multinational Age we face now. Brown kids may not be able to afford university, but their academic masters want to teach them how to talk about race. NO. SORRY. BOO. BATSU. NO GO.

    >>you wrote – “Korean media and and the English-language K-pop blogosphere.”

    This blogoshere is – most likely equal parts Korean national, Korean American, and white American/European readers, plus people from Japan, China etc. with an interest in Korea. The blogosphere is not just for english teachers anymore, folks, so let’s be careful about assumptions. In other words, the people that don’t like Tiger JK’s rant are not a bunch of white dudes. They are, in many respects, his community, with many sharing the same background. Jury of your Peers, right? Perhaps this is not defensive white dudes (or maybe it is) but maybe it is not. We don’t know. But, both Hecklers and Trolls on Twitter again shaped the discussion.

    Personally, I am sick to death over Twitter Wars over words by people that seriously never leave the house. People have no authentic engagement with an issue – they just spew spew spew and there is no follow through, resolution, or forward motion. At least Tiger JK had a reason, in the real world, to be pissed. And he took action.

    Here is what I do – I just make really great hybrid american/japanese style comics with a lead character that is both Japanese and authentically Bad Ass. And rather short. And he does not speak English so great, why bother? He is the traditional Greek Epic style hero – Great Skills, Great Talent, Great Flaw, warts and all. Nobody knows me because I don’t replicate the cliches of the genre. People need striucture, I suppose. Simple solutions to simple problems like race, and all I have is a love of creation and the human race. Oops. My bad!

    check it out if you like.

    https://martiancuisine.wordpress.com

  • scuttlepants

    This is an old article now, but because it was linked to a more recent article, I felt the need to comment. I’m generally impressed by the indepth, considered articles at Seoulbeats, especially those allowing me to see some of the issues faced by fans of other cultural backgrounds and races. Not this one.

    I wholeheartedly disagree on the unsubtle implication, nay, outright statement that discrimination is okay, and that TigerJK’s generalisations were fine, even a good thing. Discrimination is unacceptable. It is unacceptable in any form.

    Yes, draw attention to an issue, and yes, the issue was a valid and important one. It was clear those audience members were ignorant jerks, and yes, they were a problem. But there is no argument you can make that will convince me discrimination and generalised race-based insults (or any other generalised insults) are the way to go. I find this article and its weak justification (and the potential harm that can come of it- in both encouragement of future discrimination and potential backlash, and in the undermining of what should have been a valid argument) offensive.