Music / Idols
120220_seoulbeats_wondergirls_yeeun

Hello to Idol Singer-Songwriters

81
Written by On February 23, 2012

A couple of days ago on Seoulbeats’ Facebook page, my fellow writer Subi asked our readers, “is it important for an idol, or any singer to create their music?”  To which I say: convenient timing, Subi, very convenient.  For I was just pondering that myself upon the release of Wonder Girls’ Ye-eun‘s self-composed song “Hello to Myself,” which is featured on the Dream High 2 OST.

Upon first listen, I have to admit that I wasn’t completely sold, but a few more plays have convinced me that Ye-eun has got something special going here.  The song is unique, full of character, and showcases not only Ye-eun’s immense vocal talent and range, but her talent for composition.  I’m particularly loving the earthy instrumentals.  It’s a very different color from much of the music we see in K-pop, and I applaud Ye-eun for taking a step outside of the idol box and directly engaging with the process of creating music rather than just performing it.

Of course, it’s a mistake to say that idols are either never or minimally involved in the music production process; the list of idols who have songwriting, composing, and producing credits is extensive and encouraging.

  •  JYJ‘s break with DBSK has allowed them the artistic freedom to commandeer all aspects of the composition process
  • CN Blue‘s Yong-hwa and Jong-hyun have composed for their group’s albums (and Yong-hwa is the man responsible for the most squeal-worthy and adorable song in all of K-pop)
  • Brown Eyed Girls’ Jea and Miryo are collectively responsible for this piece of awesomeness, among others
  • B2ST’s Jun-hyung and B.A.P.’s Bang Yong-guk write many of their own raps
  • 2AM’s Jin-woon composed his solo songs

And the list goes on. Even my homegirl and secret best friend Tiffany from SNSD wrote the truly cringe-worthy rap featured on “The Boys” English release (hey, it’s a start, right?  Right?).

But despite the impressive and growing list of idols who are taking a more active part in the composing and producing of their solo/group material, the number of songs that feature idol creativity are far, far outnumbered by the sheer number of those that are written/produced by outside composers and sold to entertainment agencies.  Similarly, the dearth of songs that actually feature idols displaying some degree of musicianship beyond singing stands in stark contrast to the vast quantity of over-processed songs that have been autotuned to hell and back.  Though many idols have expressed what I’m sure is an earnest desire to get their hands dirty when it comes to musical composition, it’s still a rarity to the point that whenever an idol does engage in some aspect of music production, it winds up being newsworthy.

Personally, the disengagement between idols and the music they put out has been especially difficult for me to reconcile.  As someone who grew up playing the piano and participating very seriously in music creation (read: writing a couple of uninspired emo songs as a teenager), it was always very important to me that the musical artist him/herself play a dominant role in both the composition and performance of their own music.  To me, anything lower than this standard seemed disingenuous; as such, I was (and still am) an enormous fan of the work of Vanessa Carlton and Michelle Branch (oh, oh, and Rilo Kiley).  Watching Vanessa Carlton perform songs off of her sophomore album brought my 16-year-old self to the point of tears.  There’s an inexpressible beauty in seeing/hearing a performance that you know comes straight from the artist’s soul, and it’s something that I will always value and hold in high regard.

But I love my pop music, and specifically (obviously) I love my K-pop.  I wouldn’t be here if I didn’t.  My iTunes playlist is overloaded with synthesized and shallow crack, and I love every bit of it.  You can’t take it away from me — you’ll have to pry it from my cold, dead fingers.  And once you’ve done that, please bury me in my SNSD t-shirt.

To love K-pop is, I think, to acknowledge at least in part that what you are listening to is not really an expressive art form, but that doesn’t mean that it isn’t good music or that we can’t derive some sort of significance from the performance itself.  But at the same time, I certainly wouldn’t object if more idol names suddenly started showing up on the song credits.  I hate to say it, but personally, it would in some weird way rationalize my slightly insane obsession with K-pop and make me feel less guilty for spending all of my iTunes gift card money on K-pop while not buying Vanessa Carlton’s last album in its entirety (Vanessa, I’m sorry!  I still love you!).  Plus, I think it would be a great chance for idols to get personal when it comes to composing instrumentals and lyrics — fans always want more and more of their idols, and what better way to get a glimpse into your favorite idol’s heart than by hearing a song that he or she penned him/herself?

What do you say, readers?  Do you think that it is important for idols to be more involved in the music production process, or are you indifferent?

(Soompi, wondergirls)

Related Posts

TAGS: , , ,
  • Anonymous

    Eventually, yes. While I don’t expect rookies to come out with original songs, I would applaud idols who are 2-5 years into their kpop career to be contributing to the production side of things already. Ultimately, I view songwriting as a step forward, an indication of growth. Idols cannot be expect to only sing and dance forever. At some point, they should be developing their own style of music and moving towards communicating that to their fans. It’s just like any other job – once you’ve mastered the basics (singing and dancing), you must move on to the next level. While I also understand that some idols shy away from producing music, they must be hesitant to make that step too, and for that there would be other venues to show their growth – choregraphing the dance, getting involved in concept making, MV production, styling, etc. Songwriting would definitely not be for everyone. My point is, I just don’t wanna see 5-year idol groups blindly following everything their management company lays out for them. Then they’ll just be like those freeloaders you get on group assignments. 

    • http://twitter.com/mellowyel Mellowyel

      cosign this. Idols getting into the creative process for me means that they’re actually in the business for something more than the money and fame. I worry that the current idol generation will simply be out of a job once their fame fades, especially since there are so many nowadays and it’s harder to obtain the sort of long-lasting fame that former idol groups like Shinhwa and H.O.T have. Also, I think it’s easier for an idol to get into songwriting or something similar, than it is to get into acting, which seems like the back-up plan for most idols whether they have the talent or not. Getting more involved in the creative process simply makes sense as a career move, and it’s something that all idols should think seriously about IMO

  • Anonymous

    I personally don’t find it important — I’ve always thought of it as a good bonus and nothing else. Secondly, it will all go down to music that will eventually connect to me as a listener. The “songwriting” ability wouldn’t totally win me over if I didn’t like the song or if I didn’t feel the message. I will probably just appreciate the effort, but won’t easily agree that they’re suddenly more “authentic” than someone who doesn’t write their own stuff. I’ve seen some artists that have tried writing their own songs thinking that it would make people take them more seriously, only to end up getting less favorable reviews. Going back to idols…if there’s passion and talent (like GD and YeEun for example), go for it. That kind of ability shouldn’t be used to downgrade the rest who doesn’t/can’t do the same thing, though.

    Of course, I do want idols to have a say in their craft somehow, but that doesn’t automatically equate to them penning their own songs just for the sake of it. Being able to express what they want to sing and how they want to express themselves other than music (even if they don’t get what they really want 100%) is more than enough to me.

  • Anonymous

    I give credit to any idol who tries any aspect of music or artistic creativity and does it well whether it’s composition, lyrics, directing, dance, etc. I don’t mind shallow, typical kpop, but all I ask is to see growth from idols who have are now veterans. To me it shows they appreciate and have passion for music as a whole and do not just follow what their higher ups gives them. It also shows that they do not just do it for the fame, but for musical integrity. Music does not lie and listeners and fans of music a like can tell who is genuine and who is not.

    Yenny is the most talented and complete wonder girl. Her energy is infectious and even though she still doesn’t have enough lines that I would like for her to sing she is being recognized for her talent. Without her I would not be as interested of the group as I am now.

  • Anonymous

    In a perfect world all artists would compose their own music and all music would be a reflection of each artist, but that simply is not realistic. The truth is you can’t really judge K-pop acts for not writing their own music because most of the biggest acts in the world don’t write their own music at all. From Rihanna to Britney to Katy Perry to whoever, the chances are that they did not write a single song on their albums, but that’s simply not something that the public really takes into consideration when evaluating the artist as a whole. And if they did have a hand in writing any music it’s usually as a co-writer along with some ridiculous multi-grammy winning composer, which kind of leaves their participation in the composition process up in the air.  Frankly, many so called musicians really shouldn’t be considered “artists”, because most of the time the only role that they play is executing the material that they are handed, and at least in my opinion it really isn’t enough. The truly talented artists in the music industry are those who have a say in not only their image, but their musical artistry. 

  • Anonymous

    I think it’s great when they get involved… seems a bit less manufactured somehow. Although, unfortunately this problem (although much larger in the idol industry imo) extends beyond kpop. It’s a bit sad that some of these idols don’t get monetary credit for their work though… like how some companies don’t register their artists and claim the royalties from the song.

    INFINITE’s  Hoya and Dongwoo are also quite the songwriting duo. They actually wrote the lyrics to their christmas single “white confession” and Dongwoo wrote “covergirl”. Their song “crying” is quite nice as well. They write all of their own raps (which explains some of Dongwoo’s engrish tbh) and they are now officially registered as songwriters by the Korean Music Copyright Association.

  • Anonymous

    I think it definitely shows progress that they’re moving past manufactured, that the idol status allows them to pretty much have access to so many resources and you’d be stupid not to take up on it, which some idols are.

  • http://www.twitter.com/hipployta Hipployta

    Where’s the love for FT Island,  Jay Park, Infinite’s Dongwoo, and the ever present GD? I love that you mentioned BYG writes as well though LOL.

  • Anonymous

    how could G-DRAGON not be in this list?! he’s surely the most successful one out there

    • Anonymous

      lol i was thinking the same thing

      the first thing that came to my mind was GD when i read the title

  • http://arbitrary-greay.livejournal.com/ Arbitrary_greay

    My main stance on this issue is that the job of an idol, to me, is to be entertaining by any means necessary, whether through performance, variety, or producing music. If they entertain me through music that they created themselves, good for them. But is it important that idols are involved in the production process? If they’re entertaining in other ways, hell no. “Idol” and “singer-songwriter” are not mutually exclusive jobs, but by no means is the latter a subset or requirement of the former. If idols want to become singer-songwriters, then they can graduate from being an idol to being a singer-songwriter. If they want to keep being idols, I’m okay with that too. I am a big fan of some of those “talentless” Jpop idols, after all.(From a documentary I watched, they actually put a lot of thought into how exactly they perform, for how unpolished they look.) Good music or even performance are sometimes optional, although it helps a lot for my fandom. It just so happens that idols are expected to release music, too.  

    Classical musicians are very rarely involved in the “production” of their music other than performing it. Conductors do even less for the big orchestras that already know their music well, but get all of the credit for the success of the piece. Actually I find it annoying when a conductor screws up a good piece by attempting to put their own interpretation on it.(And get a standing ovation for it anyways, grrr.) Similarly, the crooner genre is built entirely on covers of old standards. Name one self-penned Sinatra song. Nat King Cole wrote some of his own songs, but his claims to fame were covers of “The Christmas Song” and “Unforgettable.” One could argue that American artists’ talents were judged by whether they were worthy to participate in Tony Bennett’s duets album, still entirely composed of covers of old classics.  Also, Whitney Houston’s(RIP) signature “I Will Always Love You” is a cover of Dolly Parton. That doesn’t make her any less amazing of an artist, even without the rest of her career for context. I don’t see why it should be any different for idols.  

    The other thing is simply quality control. SM says that they put the member-penned lyrics up against professionally penned-lyrics, hence why fewer of their submissions make it to release, which I agree with, because self-written =/= good. (Although it makes me wonder how bad Teddy Riley’s written rap was if they went with Tiffany’s.) The credibility inherently accorded to the singer-songwriter genre has actually made me slightly biased against the genre. First, see my first point above about classical musicians,  and secondly, it’s not like any of these singer-songwriters are reaching the composition levels of self-performing composers like Sarasate, Uehara Hiromi, or even the improvisations of Gabrielo Montero. I’d rather hear a well-manufactured piece fronted by a good performer than some of the singer-songwriter crap coming from fraternity garage bands. (Conversely, some of the prestige inherently accorded to classical music is misplaced, too, and there are magnificent singer-songwriter compositions/performances. Classical music was pop music back in the day, but they just have the advantage of hundreds of years to weed out the stinkers and leave only the masterpieces behind.)

    Statements like “anything lower than this standard seemed disingenuous” also always rub me the wrong way because the importance of sincerity in music in the first place is dubious. Just look at Rossini, who never wrote a day in his life after he got rich. The majority of Bach and Mozart pieces were also cranked out for money. Even if the composers had inspirational genius to spare and the results were brilliant, doesn’t mean that the original intent was sincere at all. The same goes for the master producers and songwriters behind today’s music. The songs of the likes of RedOne, Max Martin, E-Tribe, and Yasushi Akimoto shouldn’t be discounted just for being “disingenuous.” Furthermore, why then do actors get a pass for when they don’t participate in script-writing, directing, cinematography, etc.? Or on stage, where most actors don’t write the script or songs in musicals. Why aren’t they ”disingenuous?” I know you may not have this belief anymore, Dana, given your current acceptance of pop, but I just have to express some of my frustrations with that kind of sentiment anyways.

    • http://twitter.com/Laava90 Lava

      Ooh you have exactly my opinion, I wrote my more crappy version and then saw your comment after I refreshed the page and you worded everything so perfectly ^__^ The actor/script writer example is exactly perfect, and I’m the same as you I actually tend to avoid some singer/songwriter type songs simply because people give them so so much credit that it just gets really irritating.

    • Anonymous

      Arbitrary_greay, your comment just reminded again me why I write for Seoulbeats :) great food for thought there.  Thanks for reading and putting such thought into commenting!  I definitely can’t disagree with many of the poitns that you make.

    • Anonymous

      well i do believe that some actors aren’t that entitled in following each of every dialogue exactly as it’s written and they need to do their own interpretation of their role. and some actors are probably participating in contributing ideas for their roles, or speak up if they felt disappointed with the script given and gave their opinion about it (i’ve only heard about kang haejung’s publicly spoke out her disappointment towards her character in miss ripley in later episodes, or a “complain” for not getting kiss scene hehe). it’s just we probably can’t see them credited for that and it’s not like they want the credits for that. maybe it’s off topic, but i just want to point that some actors actually do participating in their role.

  • http://twitter.com/Laava90 Lava

    I don’t think it’s necessary for them to be producing the music at all, it’s more of a bonus tbh. I think the important thing is that they singer likes the song that they’re singing, and it’s always good if they can give their opinions, etc on it but that would come naturally with experience anyway. I feel like sometimes people put too much importance on somebody producing the songs that they sing, but what if they simply do not possess that talent, but they sing beautifully and have an amazing voice? Same can be said for the producers, there must be so many amazing producers out there but they may not have the voice or the talent for singing, or for performing and drawing people in with a performance. This is the reason why there are seperate words for the profession in the first place, singer does not have to equal song writer/producer, just as nobody expects a producer/song writer to get up on stage and sing their  songs. They’re two different jobs in a chain of getting the song out for people to hear, somebody writes the song and somebody gets a singer up on a platform to sing the song for people to hear. I feel like writing your own songs is so overrated sometimes, and for that reason some people tend to look down on amazing singers who didn’t have a hand in writing their music. One example I can think of is in terms of older middle eastern music, the greatest songs were made by one person writing a poetry type song, then a composer adding music and finally an amazing singer going on stage and singing the song for everybody.
    So in conclusion basically what I’m saying is, it’s not necessary at all for these idols to have a hand in writing their music, when they do of course we all get excited, and it kind of feels like you’re hearing something special of your favorite idol and hearing about things that they feel, but at the same time, if they didn’t write it, so what? If the song is great then as long as the person singing it loves it too and can do it justice then that’s all that matters really. 
    It’s more of a bonus when someone writes their own songs, they’re doing two jobs in one, but it’s not like they have to be put on a pedastal for it which is sometimes the case.

  • http://twitter.com/denzelwynter アシュリ// 애쉴리 (Ashley)

    The joke is they would actually make more money if they did contribute to their actual songs! 

  • Anonymous

    my personal favorite has to be TOP. the music he writes just feels really personal and it connects with me emotionally. when he performs those songs, he gets so into it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pRaZOG5RQM8 

    he’s so underrated. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYWBpSpabIc

    • Anonymous

      he’s my fave too. a good man is my fave bb song and i love onneuldara. his lyrics are generally a cut above the rest. he doesn’t really write radio-friendly hits like gd but he’s a very good songwriter.

  • Anonymous

    I think there’s a certain stigma attached to the term ‘idol’ that many idols are now actually trying to get away from. In the Korean Entertainment industry, idols aren’t seen as musicians. I think they’re seen more as manufactured products. They’re packaged images sold to young audiences that gobble up conventional pop music. I think it’s apparent that most idols do not debut to promote music – they debut to promote themselves and their images. There’s a definite difference between people like Tiger JK, Leessang, DJ DOC, 10cm (and etc) and the idols that entertainment companies pump out. With an artistic (in the sense that these people are not idols, but artists) group like DJ Doc, Leessang, and 10cm, the way in which the group was formed is much more organic. They weren’t plucked from a mass of trainees all competing to launch sooner than the other. The root of their bond with each other is music. And that’s completely different with idols. Idols usually know, when going into the training process, that when they debut, they will be 80% image and 20% music. That may also be the reason so many idol groups have fallen apart after five years while groups like the aforementioned have been going 10 or more years strong.

    That’s the defining line between idols and artists – the music. Most idol groups have little to no say in the music they release. Yes, some idols may compose a song here and there, but how long does it take for them to get to the point where the company trusts them enough to let them do this? And how often do these tracks actually get promoted as title tracks?

    I agree that it’s a great thing that some idols are stepping up to the plate and writing and composing their own music, but I don’t think that will de-stigmatize the term ‘idol’ any time soon. Many other celebrities joke about wanting to be idols because of their abounding popularity, but how many times have we heard sunbaes and bigtimes in the music industry actually REALLY complement an idol on their music? It’s rare.

    So, I don’t go around saying that an idol isn’t an idol because they don’t produce their own music. I think being an idol, that’s actually expected of you. I’m also not entirely impressed when idols come out with a song or two either because I’m sure their entertainment company had some sort of shadow producer or writer there.

    The only person I’m actually impressed with is GD because he’s consistently churned out hit after hit after hit. From their debut, I think BB made it clear that they were idols, but not in the sense that most people would think. I think it’s best described in the tweet HAHA recently posted about Big Bang’s Blue. He said they seem like “national stars instead of idols”, and that makes me think that they’ve reached a whole new ballgame. Not many idol groups have/can break the barrier into being recognized as successful artists instead of prepackaged imagery. And I have so much love and respect for Big Bang doing so.

    And for other idols/idol groups to get to that point as well, I think entertainment companies need to focus on the music over the image. Or maybe YG just got lucky with Big Bang. But other than them, I haven’t seen one idol group do the same or even seem like they have the prospects of being able to achieve the same.

    (As a side note: I agree with lostmunkie. I’ve always been really impressed by the songs TOP has produced and written. I actually prefer them over most of GD’s.)

    The bottom line is that most idols don’t have much music credibility anyway, so when they release things they themselves produced and wrote, it doesn’t make that big of a deal. Which, at the end of the day, is kind of sad.

  • Anonymous

    Don’t forget Yuri wrote the lyrics for their R&B Ballad “Mistake!” on the Hoot album
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ts7okyBjXw and 

    AND

    Sooyoung wrote the lyrics for “How Great is Your Love” on The Boys album

    Normally not a fan of SNSD’s Cute-Pop songs… I really like the Dance-Pop direction they’re going into, but their R&B/Ballad stuff is amazing, and these two mentioned are even more awesome since they wrote these songs. Serious SM should give their artists more creative freedom… Which is why it’s bittersweet for JYJ, who had to leave DBSK and break fans hearts, but they’re able to break boundaries that they weren’t able to when they were stuck at SM. Which is why I believe their artists like Henry or Amber are not able to show their true potential. 

    • Anonymous

      Holy mother-effing crap. Why have I not heard these songs?!?!?!?! Honestly SM, get SNSD to do more R&B than the cute crap and Britney Spears pop that they’re doing now… WTF!?!? Sorry. Never heard that they did songs like this until I clicked the links. And wow I always thought Sooyoung and Yuri just did backup vocals and look pretty but the translation of they lyrics are amazing. Definitely deserve more credit. Just looked up more of their R&B material and their song “Star Star Star” is also amazing!
      –> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jT06kE1IEBA

      • Anonymous

        If you like SNSD’s r&b stuff, listen to their Japanese Album. Completely annihilates all their Korean material. yeah i totally agree with Selena’s comment. SM is worst at giving creative freedom to their artists. JYP have to rely on JY Park’s compositions, but at least there’s some creativity there, unlike SM who has to either buy songs or ask composers and producers from all around the world. YG is the best at giving their artists artistic freedom. 

        • Anonymous

          Links please? Too LAZZZYYY look for them. xp

          • Anonymous

            Here’s a really good song from their Japanese Album, “Let it Rain.” Very good blend of R&B/J-POP. Honestly, the music they release in Japan is MUCH better than their Korean Music releases. SM should be ashamed in not giving any of their artists any control in the music they want to release. 

            In the same channel, you can find all their other Japanese songs. 

          • http://arbitrary-greay.livejournal.com/ Arbitrary_greay

            Yeah, except it’s not like SNSD had any creative control over their Japan album, either. 

            If anything, blame the Korean public for gobbling up songs like “Oh!” and the fandom for loving songs like “Best Friend,” and “My J.” 

          • Anonymous

            They didn’t have any creative control for their Japanese efforts, but they had control in the option of music they wanted to do, being with Universal Music Japan, who had more control over the album than SM did. The girls in an interview stated they didn’t want to take the cutesy road that Japan is already infamous with, and they were finally able to release music they wanted to do through their Japanese album. Obviously none of them could write songs in Japanese. But I seriously blame how a lot of the Korean fans, especially those weird fangirls who like to take cute pictures of themselves, whine with aegyo and act cute to their oppas, and perverted guys too who love their cute stuff, I swear they eat it up like McDonald’s or something. 

          • http://arbitrary-greay.livejournal.com/ Arbitrary_greay

            Actually, in Jpop things work differently. The label merely distributes the end product, and the management still has all of the say over the production. Technically, SNSD are on the same label as SDN48, Momoiro Clover, and GReeeeN, but their production, including music styles, are all wildly different, because they’re all under different management companies and thus different franchises.(Exceptions being Johnny’s and Avex)

            So SM was still behind all of the decisions in SNSD’s Japan marketting. 

          • Anonymous

            I guess what the argument is trying to conclude to is that SNSD’s Japanese releases are a tad better than their past Korean releases. But I, myself, like their recent R&B, Dance-Pop, Electropop, Ballad music (Run Devil Run, Star Star Star, Forever, Hoot, Mistake, The Boys, Trick, Oscar, How Great is Your Love, etc.) But their whole Japanese album was the first album I liked as a whole. In their Korean productions, there’s always just a few songs, then some cutesy fillers that their entertainment company won’t let them escape from, but that’s what some Korean fans actually like from them. They obviously know they can’t go the Bubblegum Pop route when they go to the States or Europe. They cater to different audiences. Hopefully one day they’ll be able to compose and write at least 50% of their album. But they don’t need to now. 

    • Anonymous

      Wow… SNSD does these kinds of songs? and writes some of their own material? Should give them song props. Tell me why SM does not give them more creative freedom?…. Anyways I’d like to thank you. After browsing through their ballads and R&B material and letting me know that the pretty faces can also write songs, I think the SONE fan club has just gained another member today. 

      • Anonymous

        Lol well I’m not a SONE nor am I in any fan club… I think those things are childish. And I guess your welcome? SNSD has gotten a lot of heat for some of their past cutesy releases… Their whole first album with Kissing You, Gee, and Oh, and are barely recognized for their mature efforts (Tell Me Your Wish, Run Devil Run, The Boys), but I believe a lot of the material where they write their own songs, sing strong ballads, and do the kind of music that they love doing, like R&B, Urban-Pop, Dance, etc. is most often neglected, and after uncovering some of those songs, I became a fan. I think that if SNSD hopped on to the creative bandwagon and wasn’t forced to rely on SM’s uncreative mishaps, then they would fair much better as artists. This also goes for other idol groups. 

        • Anonymous

          I’ve never paid attention to SNSD… I know that they released a stupid annoying Gee song and that’s all. Never knew that they had any depth as an artists until I clicked on the links and saw what the fuss is about. Their written material sounds good… Then why is SM forcing them to do all this non-sense?

          • Anonymous

            Because SM’s highups (including Lee Soo-man) are more concerned with earning big bucks and keeping most of the profit for themselves rather than go through the process of making good music.  

          • Anonymous

            I think SMs made some of the most iconic music in kpop. I just think there’s only so much music you can get from a handful of composers and producers in Korea. I think they’re more rushed to put on music than anything. Fans need to stop expecting a comeback from their idols every dawn year. I think quality would be better if there wasn’t an expectation of quantity.

          • Anonymous

            SM Entertainment is something I would compare to a big US Major Record label, where they have a lot of artists, and don’t really get any personal time with their artists, so they force them to release music that the Entertainment Company thinks would make them successful and make them earn big bucks, and a huge example would be L.A. Reid’s choice of music with Pink. He made her do R&B music, when she really wanted to do Pop-Rock. Same goes for SNSD. In many interviews and variety shows, the girls, and especially Taeyeon, said they HATED their earlier material, and want to do more mature things like Run Devil Run and Genie. Even the youngest and deemed “most innocent,” Seohyun, said she wants their image to change into more fiercer and confident girls than the oppa-loving/cute girl next door image that they were originally given. But what can they do, they can’t leave the company because of their slave contracts, and if they do, SM will strip them of all their rights to their songs, and leave them penniless… Sigh.

          • Anonymous

            Watch the first few minutes of this video –> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_ULad8FtV4&feature=channel 

    • Anonymous

      Wow… SNSD does these kinds of songs? and writes some of their own material? Should give them song props. Tell me why SM does not give them more creative freedom?…. Anyways I’d like to thank you. After browsing through their ballads and R&B material and letting me know that the pretty faces can also write songs, I think the SONE fan club has just gained another member today. 

    • Anonymous

      Wow… SNSD does these kinds of songs? and writes some of their own material? Should give them song props. Tell me why SM does not give them more creative freedom?…. Anyways I’d like to thank you. After browsing through their ballads and R&B material and letting me know that the pretty faces can also write songs, I think the SONE fan club has just gained another member today. 

    • Anonymous

      Well, in retrospect, writing the LYRICS and composing the song are two very different things. If you find something one or more of the girls composed, do tell me, I’m genuinely interested :)

      • Anonymous

        I know that they are two very different things, and I know myself, even though  I’m not a huge SNSD-fan/SONE/Anti-who-pretends-to-not-give-a-what-but-is-a-hypocrite-for-listening-to-their-music-and-has-nothing-to-do-with-their-lives-but-bash-them/Troll (you get the point), I know that they haven’t composed a song for themselves yet. I don’t expect them to, well maybe not in long time, and they don’t have to. There’s some great artists out there that haven’t written or composed their own material, but they sound great none on the less and execute songs very well. There’s also a lot of singer-songwriters that don’t compose their own music for their songs (big examples: Ne-Yo, Beyonce) I’m just saying that at least they have some creative aspects of writing lyrics for some of their songs, and hopefully, that would be a step in having more creative artistry and freedom in their future musical releases. But as long as their in SM, it’s just hopeful wishing. I hope they change CEO’s and the way they do things there… 

    • Anonymous

      According to various websites the songwriter of “how great is your love” is Jennny Hyun…
      Maybe Sooyoung cowrote it with her? Anyway I don’t think you can give full credit to Sooyoung on that one.

      • Anonymous

        Jenny Hyun was the original songwriter for her own take on the song, “I Still Believe in Love” which was also originally sung in English. When she sold her song to SM Entertainment, Sooyoung’s lyrics were chosen for the Korean Version of the song, which is now called “How Great is Your Love.” I think that she deserves some credit, but the song is not original since it was “bought by SM,” which goes to show how uncreative SM Entertainment is. But still, it’s nice to know that there’s some creative potential. I know Tiffany has been trying to submit her own lyrics, but her Korean is not strong so I don’t know how that’s going to work…

    • http://arbitrary-greay.livejournal.com/ Arbitrary_greay

      It’s well known that BoA has a significant amount of SM stock and thus has much more say in her career:  http://www.soompi.com/news/boa-speaks-out-onShe apparently composed (wrote the melody and lyrics, although did not do the arrangement) two of the songs on Hurricane Venus. She also says that she didn’t expect SM to choose the song, but they surprised her by doing so, so maybe the reason SNSD doesn’t appear to have more of their own works out there is simply because SM doesn’t think what they’ve made matches up to what professionals have made. So fans can be truly proud of what has made the cut and not consider it a gimmick release. 

  • Anonymous

    As a person who was a DBSK since 2005, I always thought it didn’t matter if an artist wrote their own song or not. And I still sort of feel this way. As long an artist is able to emote while singing and makes the song their own, then I will still enjoy it. 

    However, once DBSK split and JYJ started to create their own music, I think I understood for the first time why people tend to have a preference for artists to write their own music. 
    Though all five member always had passion while singing, I feel it just that much more in JYJ’s music. 
    You can feel the pain and anger in Untitled Song, you can feel the sadness in In Heaven. I think the artists themselves are more attached to these songs, so when they perform them, they do it with the upmost care and emotions they can put into it. 

    There really is nothing like hearing a singer perform a song they wrote and composed themselves. You will never see a purer picture of musical passion than that. 
    Also, it’s a good feeling buying a piece of music and knowing that the artist you support is actually going to get a cut of the money. 

    So while I don’t that idols who sing pre-composed, pre-written songs aren’t proper singers, and while I still listen to and enjoy songs that were written by people other than the singers; JYJ has really showed me the benefits of having a singer write their own material. 

  • http://twitter.com/carnimiriel Ruby

    I think that if an idol has the interest and musicality to express through composing, writing and/or production, that’s so much the better.  However, more than that, what’s important is that the idols should be able to connect with and communicate through the songs they perform.  They don’t have to write it to make it their own.  Examples I can think of is Tim McGraw’s Live Like You Were Dying, which was so identified with his relationship with his deceased father; and I’ll never forget listening to Bernadette Peters singing Not A Day Goes By at her first major concert since her husband’s death.  Neither song was written by the singer.  

    In my opinion, what perpetuates the shallow image of Kpop and boy/girl band pop in general, is that there’s clearly no emotional resonance to most of the songs and often the singers are not connected to the material.

    Which is not to say that there isn’t a place for fun and happy pop songs, just that it shouldn’t only be those types of songs.

  • Anonymous

    I feel that pop music is popular because it lacks depth, to be honest. In any culture. Can anyone say Kesha’s music or Party Rock Anthem got them through a hard time? While everyone likes a good song with a message (whether it’s getting over a breakup or knowing that you’re special) it’s hardly the real, creative stuff with feeling that gets noticed. An example on the American market would be Lil Wayne compared to Immortal Technique. I promise over half of the readers don’t know who Immortal Technique is and he built a school in Afghanistan. People have jobs, school, bills, and people to put up with. When I come home from a rough day at work, I turn on something light & fun (I love me some Wondergirls &

    • Anonymous

      Hmm, I see where you’re coming from, but only SOME popular songs lack depth. It depends what country/local area you’re from I suppose – I live in a college town and in every restaurant I hear a song from Adele’s album at least once a day (not to mention also on the radio), but she’s not really full on pop is she? And her songs are not at all similar to Kesha or LMFAO in terms of lyrics or depth. One Republic that gets regular airplay and other bands are not so shallow as Lil Wayne I believe.

      I would also like to add that decades back during the Counterculture era (60s through 80s maybe?), plenty of music was popular (ex: the Beatles, even Michael Jackson) that were not only fun and catchy music but also spoke of deeper meaning… I mean that’s just me, but I think popular music is not popular BECAUSE it lacks depth – there is still a high demand for real “artistic” music these days too - but depth-less music is what the culture (aka the young people) wants today. Back then, people cared way less about presentation (usually musicians went au naturel with the scruffy beards and unshaved legs) and more about sending a message, because that was the political and social atmosphere of the time, that’s what the people DEMANDED. Now, people want danceable beats, something to groove to in the club. And it’s kind of hard to let loose when an artist is singing about starving children in Africa or the need for world peace.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_LL4QDJLVFDT2RDIZYBALSE75JE angel29

    Is there a reason why GD and TOP were not mentioned?  Unless these BigBang members are no longer considered idols (I would completely understand), the omission does not make sense.  Despite having worn the “songwriter” and “producer” hats for quite a time, surely they are worth mentioning in this article.  Even Seungri has composed more than some of the artists you’ve mentioned above and a couple have landed strongly on the charts.

    • Anonymous

      Lately this topic has interested me… whether or not an idol group can “outgrow” that image. I’ve read a few times of people arguing that BB is no longer idols… Maybe an SB writer can address this?

      Also with the Brown Eyed Girls – “are they idols or not?” debate. I’m sure there’s plenty more to explore but as I’m in a rush I’ll leave it here. :)

      P.S. Sorry for replying to your comment specifically, it’s kinda OT but the first sentences caught my eye ;D

    • Anonymous

      Well I’d stop mentioning them too since CERTAIN people keep jumping down the writers’ throats and calling them YG biased whenever they talk about Big Bang or 2ne1 hahahahaha.

    • http://twitter.com/Laava90 Lava

      They just made a rough list, GD & Top don’t need to be mentioned all the time, I’m sure there are many more writer/idols that weren’t mentioned…

    • Anonymous

      I’m sorry but Big Bang is still very much an idol. Elitist fans need to realize that despite the fact that they have a lot of artistic freedom there are still the very definition of idols.

      • Anonymous

        I’m sorry, you’re entitled to your opinion but anyone and everyone who disagrees with you is not necessarily an elitist fan. A good case can be made for bigbang still being an idol group but it’s also become increasingly easy to make a case that they’re not. The same is true of a few other groups like jyj or beg.

        My opinion is that they fall somewhere in the middle but if they’re the very definition of an idol group, then why dont more idol groups follow the same formula?

        • Anonymous

          In what way are they not idols? They go to variety shows, they have trained under an entertainment agency for a while, they do fanservice, they do cfs… That’s the exact definition of an idol. JYJ are also idols. Brown Eyed Girls at the beginning were not idols, but after Sound G and Abracadabra they can be defined as idols too.

          By same formula you mean writing their own songs? That’s because of the agency itself, not the group. Technically only G-Dragon (and TOP to some extent) writes the music for Big Bang, so why is the whole group credited? 

          There is nothing wrong with being an idol group, but, like I said, elitist YG fans seem to put Big Bang on an pedestal because G-Dragon writes their music. Which btw has been vastly exaggerated as he does not have nearly as many songs credited to him as we’ve been led to believe.

          • Anonymous

            I agree with this completely. Especially about the no shame of being an idol part. I will always see big bang as an idol group with an image and put together by a company. They put on concerts, promote themselves, are given concepts, and release music based in large part by the company. There’s nothing wrong with it… just imo.

          • Anonymous

            THANK YOU. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with being idols.

            Also another point; if they were not idols, they would not have to deny their dating scandals in order not to piss off their fanbase.

          • http://twitter.com/dds87 dechen

             Every actors and actresses in the Korean ent industry hides their relationships…and only makes it public when they are gonna get married!

          • Anonymous

            are idols the only ones who go on varieties, do cfs and fanservice? people like wheesung, park hyo shin, lee seung gi and iu do all these things as well. not because they’re idols but because they’re commercial singers appealing to a mass audience. heck, pretty much every celebrity in korea does these things. many of the biggest actors do and have all the things that idols do – fanclubs, fanservice, cfs, varieties, merchandise, agency restrictions etc.
             
            no, by formula i mean creative control. actually, there are several songs credited to “bigbang” that means all 5 of them get royalties from those songs, so all of bigbang do contribute to their songwriting to a certain extent. i don’t know what number of songs you thought gd has written or were led to believe that he had written, but the last time i checked the korean music copyright association database, gd had about 125 songs, top about 75, seungri and yb should have about 20 and daesung has 10. that’s more than enough for the whole group to be credited with some songwriting ability. both gd and top are among the musicians who earn quite a bit of money via royalties, especially gd.
             
            and creative control is not just songwriting, it’s about producing as well, among other things, and all 5 are credited on the album in that regard. gd is the “producer” and the other 4 are “co-producers” and all 5 of them are “recording directors”.
             
            their creative input also extends to choreography, concert planning, styling, album design, album marketing, mv production and merchandise design and this is as a group, solo and for other yg artists.
             
            and then there’s the control that they can exercise over their company simply because they’re bigbang. when an idol group and its members solos’ comprise 60-70% of an agency’s annual profits, when news about them can and does directly impact yg’s stock and future plans, when their non-music ventures such as movies or dramas or musicals are additional investment opportunities for yg (which he has used in the past with positive returns) and when certain members are commanding solo cf rates so high that only seo taiji and rain make more money, it puts them in a unique position in that agency, one they can use to their advantage or as a bargaining chip if they choose to.
             
            the fact that they trained under an agency and were put together by that agency is why i said i remain in the middle about whether they are idols or not because yg will always have that control over them. but that control is not a constant and shinhwa are an example of that.
             
            there is nothing wrong with being an idol. but you’re assuming the op meant something was wrong with it. an idol group’s profile can change and all the 3 groups that i mentioned have seen their profile change. whether an idol group can outgrow that label over time is a perfectly valid question and not an elitist assumption.
             
            ps  the bb formula works in yg but yg is not solely responsible for it. 2ne1 doesn’t follow that formula and it doesn’t look like the 2 new groups will either. neither do any of the other yg artists, except tablo and psy. yg got lucky when he recruited bb because they were interested in songwriting/production and he encouraged their talents and nutured it but it’s clearly not a formula he’s looking to replicate en masse because songwriting skills are not something he now necessarily looks for in potential trainees.
             
             

          • http://twitter.com/dds87 dechen

             I do agree that there is absolutely no shame in being an idol!
            But GD right now has about 120 songs(i’ve not added the new album yet) credited to his name…which is a pretty good number  considering the fact tht he’s been in the industry for abt 6 yrs and he actively promoted about 90% of the songs!

          • Anonymous

            Of those 120 songs maybe around 20 of those are only credited to GD alone.

  • Anonymous

    Deleted

  • http://twitter.com/kaylanurul Nurul Rochayati

    You forgot to put Donghae there! He composed a good number of songs for Super Junior and SM truly needs him if they want to take off from those crappy overtuned songs. He impressed me with ‘Y”

  • http://twitter.com/phannan Ana Hannah

    I love YeEun’s works with Saying I Love You, For Wonderful, Smile, GNO, Me, In, and Hello to Myself :) Yubin also writes her own raps, SunYe’s composed before, Sohee’s helped in production, and Lim co-wrote/co-produced Act Cool.

    Yup, GD is infamous throughout the industry as BB’s resident producer. GD&TOP and now SeungRi are good examples.

  • http://twitter.com/aya_aika Aika

    Yenny!!!!G.N.O and ME.IN’re the BEST!!!!HELLO TO MYSEL’s so AMAZING!!!!

  • http://twitter.com/Celangel Celangel

    I just wanna applaud Yeeun for her ever-growing song-writing skills. From “saying I love you” to “GNO” to “Hello to Myself”, they are all different in style all and yet awesome hits. I have to say I was shocked she did GNO which was a dance track when all this while I thought she could only compose ballads. 
    Like the author, I love Michelle Branch and one of her songs “Goodbye to You” was one of those few ballads that I can feel a mix of happy and sad emotions when I listen to it to which I’ll replay it to no end. And I must say, no other song has given me that same feeling until I heard Yeeun’s “Hello to myself”. It’s not so much of the lyrics but the melodies of these songs that gets me emotional(well for one thing, I can’t read Korean). Ironically and coincidentally, the titles of these 2 songs are opposite in meaning literally. 
    In any case, I am all for more idol-songwriters like Yeeun and more to emerge in kpop. Bring them on!

  • http://twitter.com/JM7228JW J-MayTan©

     how could u forget about Donghae, Henry and Leeteuk? :(

  • http://weeatlemon.blogspot.com conanblue

    I think as musicians it’ll be nice if they know how to write their own songs. But as idols? I don’t really think so. Mostly because I think idols are made for the general public. In order to do that, you have to be able to make the most irritatingly catchy song you can ever make. That isn’t really something everyone can do. If an idol is able to write/compose/produce a catchy tune, then they’re gold. They can keep their jobs and have somewhat of a longevity in the pop kingdom. But if they want to write music as musicians, then go right ahead. But don’t expect to see their songs topping the charts, unless they still have that star power they have in their heyday. I’m not saying it’s a bad thing, but it’s just a different form of success.

  • Anonymous

    I don’t think it’s necessary for idols to write their own lyrics and compose their own music because, frankly, they’re idols.  In their defense, some of the most renowned singers never wrote any of their own lyrics or composed their own music.  For years a singer/songwriter was a rarity.  In the same vein, the singers that were considered artists, made up for not writing and composing with their enormous talent.  This is why, unlike most idols, they can still be taken seriously.  IMO, to be considered a true artist you also have to have creative control.  This is why a lot of idols are considered product because other people are making the creative decisions for them.  They don’t make the final decisions when it comes to what a stylist does to their image, what songwriters and producers they get to work with, or what concepts they have for their comebacks.  Even worse, many times they’re stuck doing a genre of music they don’t even like.  When you are looking at designers and choosing them to help create your look, when you pick the music video directors and give them some idea of what concept you want for your MV, when you get to select the choreographers you want to work with, when you get to decide what cover art you want for your album, even without writing lyrics and composing I consider that person an artist.   There are a lot of singer/songwriters out there who really should just be writing IMO because they have limited vocal talent.  Many have written great songs that I wish had been sung by someone else instead (rock vocalists get a pass though…lol)  Great singers may not be the best composers and songwriters so they don’t need to waste their time if it’s only going to be sub par.   

    Musicians, on the other hand, are usually held to a totally different standard, especially if they’re in a band.  If you’re at least composing, it’s not always necessary to write the lyrics.  Elton John is a prime example of that.  Everyone in the band doesn’t have to be responsible for composing but a least one person should be doing it.  Unfortunately groups like CNBLUE and FT Island get a lot of flack for the couple of songs they don’t write themselves and for having to hand sync in an industry that really doesn’t support live music.  While they get criticized by fellow musicians for not writing all their songs, interestingly enough, Elvis who still to this day is called the King of Rock and Roll even by music critics, never wrote or composed a single one of his songs. 

    • http://arbitrary-greay.livejournal.com/ Arbitrary_greay

      Do you consider T-ara to still be idols? From the looks of things, CCM is according them a lot of control to them, especially the leader. (A little to the detriment of their health, I think…)

  • chocovagabond

    I actually prefer it when artists write their own music. To me, that’s kinda the point of being an “artist”–making your own work. Anyone can pay someone to write a song for them. I’m not saying that those who don’t aren’t worthy to be called an artist, but when they write their own music, they gain more respect from me. When idols get involved in the composing and/or the song-writing of their music, you can’t help but feel connected with them–you can understand the emotions they put in the song.

    • Anonymous

      I agree. To me that’s the defining point between an artist and an entertainer. Both have challenges & require a lot of work, no doubt, but they’re definitely different.

  • Anonymous

    It’s kind of unfair to expect all the idols to all start developing songwriting and music production skills because not everyone has the talent for it. While we may have a few current idols who are able to and have written songs already, it’s not for everyone.

    Being knowledgable in music production will extend your life as a musician after the idol days. For the others, what they need to do is to perform the songs they’re given to the best of their ability and sing well because that is their current job now. Suprisingly many current idols can’t even manage that. To me it’s kind of disrespectful to the people who did write the song. (Even if it’s a crappy song, a performer should try to make it look good regardless). 

  • Anonymous

    A problem I’ve noticed now though is how the idols don’t seem to try to connect to their songs at all which can make a performance seem very detached and lifeless. If it’s a happy song you should try to act happy and not have the IDGAF look on stage. Unfoortunately most idols have the grueling schedules. It’s a vicious cycle.   

  • http://twitter.com/PhanTheHotness Jenny

    honestly with soooo many idols “writing” their own songs, it just so…..
    there’s not many that have good lyrics or composition.

    for example. JYJ are great singers, but as writers and composers themselves, i think every song sounds the same. and fans PRAISE them for every single song they wrote.
    some are good, but others are just so bland

    GD is really good and i’m not even a VIP. i think his lyrics have a lot of depth and thought.
    composition is catchy and i really enjoy it.

    other idols like junhyung are getting there. i think his lyrics need more depth and his composition needs a lot of work but its getting there.

    Band young guk of B.A.P is good too. i like his lyrics to songs, but he mostly had help on them too so it wasn’t like he wrote it all himself. he had guidance.

  • Anonymous

    for me junhyung’s rap is… too cringe-worthy at times. sorry. i think yeeun has a great potential. jyp please don’t waste her.

  • Anonymous

    Its weird not to have and article like this and to not even mention GD, its like a glaring omission since when you think about idol songwriters i think most would first look to him. I don’t know maybe the author thought it was to obvious. 

    Any way I good song is a good song no matter who wrote it, that being said there is something special about knowing it was their own work behind it. 

    I guess my perception is colored by following more of the rock scene were you would be laughed at if you released a song composed by someone else.  

  • Anonymous

    It doesn’t matter who can or can’t write songs.  Heck, all of us can do it, but will it be good? Tell, me this, out of all the idol songwriters, and the songs they wrote and composed, how many of those songs are title tracks?  Not many.  I give respect to the ones that are able to write and compose a title track.  That means the song is good/great enough to beat all other songs made by other composers.  That proves the skill and talent of the idol.  

  • Anonymous

    The author of this article sounds a lot like me! Besides Kpop, any “real”/American/English music I listen to is singer-songwriter stuff.

    I’m liking this trend of idols taking more creative control. And yeah, a lot of people were left off the list, (most notably to me GD as many of the commenters before have already expressed) but these seem like more recent examples. Frankly, I find that I enjoy songs that idols compose better than promoted songs. Take for example, some of the songs Donghae composed for SJ’s latest album. Even some SNSD girls have taken a stab at lyric writing (I think Yuri.) It’s a first step.
    I think it’s an important skill to have in the music/entertainment industry. It’s not necessary for idols to succeed, but in the off-chance that they ever leave their company or are given an opportunity to promote solo songs, wouldn’t it be better to have that skill to back them up? Understanding how the process of songwriting and producing goes also adds to better singing ability, I would think. If you understand how chords and basic theory work, you should be able to do more with your voice.

  • http://twitter.com/sen_kitty My Linh Phan

    GD’s stuff is pretty good, but some of it gets kinda… bland after a while. Yeeun’s got so much going for her in this solo song, so I’m hoping she’s not going to become another case of Company-idol-(potential)-talent-sitting-and-wasting *coughSM’sHENRYLAUcough*

    Jinwoon… suits rock quite well, I really liked his solo stuff. Taecyeon’s recent rap he wrote for ‘Wings’ off the Uni Charity album wasn’t as bad as I thought it would be – SM’s Henry and Donghae need to start composing, because YYJ is kinda losing his touch (I rather liked What Is Love though). JYP’s putting 2PM’s Jun.K (Junsu) in a corner follows me around when it comes to composing/talented/musician-dol whatever like a rabid dog that won’t go away. I mean… he’s not even my ‘bias’… ugh. Hopefully he and Junho and Chance can get together and do this next album they’re (probably) releasing this year.

    Chance – and Oneway – are debatable idols (read: not at all, and where have they been for the past year?) , but their bromance(s) with Donghae, Junsu and producing work is a Godsend. Sunny Hill’s stuff is amazing (Janghyun~ come back soon, please…. miss your voice~)

    All in all, yeah, idols can be seen composing their own stuff more. Knowing that the person performing has composed what they are singing has much more meaning behind it.

  • http://www.facebook.com/nielsgabriel Niels Gabriel Nable

    It’s actually ironic to write an article regarding singer-songwriters without even roughly mentioning BIG BANG’s G-Dragon. It’s like he’s the one behind almost all the magnificent songs of the greatest K-Pop group.

    Anyway, I think it is better if one takes over and control the words of his music because he can really express what he feels (specifically to solo artists). I, personally, would just call you a “singer” rather an “artist.”

  • http://twitter.com/KimcheeSushi フェリシア

    Hm… It would be nice and I personally have more respect for idols who writes their own songs.. it doesn’t have to be fully self-written but even if only one song it’s okay. It isn’t too important since if you follow kpop for singer song-writers then you are waay off the map. But like I said, I think it’s nice when they do. Especially when it’s based on their life experiences. It just makes it so much more meaningful than love songs about anybody. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100003507824553 ICassie Gaemgyu

    I think song writing is the main key to long term success. for eg Super Junior. I love them. But writing their own songs would help break their chains from SM. (IF they want to break free, that is..).